Help please! Temp won't rise high enough to draw off.

[Mikemartin274]

I'm new to a 2x4 continuous flow pan. It holds about 15 gallons at 2". I've been boiling on this rig for well over 10 hours now and have evaporated aproxx 150 gallons. I can't get the temp to go above 211. I was thinking I'd be drawing off at 216 or so degrees but I've yet to see that. The fire is great and boil is rapid. I'm afraid I've ruined the SAP somehow the syrup hydrometer sinks to bottom and the SAP hydrometer is maxed out over 12%. Please any advice is appreciated. Last year I batch boiled. I'm tempted to drain what in the pan and boil it all down. I thought I could get real close to syrup with this rig. Anyone else have this problem? Solution? I searched the forums but couldn't find what I need. I don't seem to get great results with search bar.

[highlandcattle]

What brand of evaporator! I have a Mason with a blower. Try a fan on it if no blower

[MunsterMapler]

Keep boiling! My 2x4 hybrid took about 180-200 gallons to sweeten the pan. It may even take more depending on what % sugar your sap is.

[jbutton]

How deep are you running it? 2 inches is to deep. I had a continuous flow my first 2 years a found that I had to run it around 1 inch. Also check your hydrometer for cracks

[Jolly Acres Farm]

I have a Mason 2x4 XL with blower. I have drawn off finished syrup with and without the blower. I run my sap at 3/4 to 1 inch deep. It took about 100 gallons to sweeten my pan, so if your running 2 inches on the same set up it would take twice as much sap as me, about 200 gallons. My sap was around 1.5 %. I hope this helps.

[bigschuss]

Just keep going. You're almost there. 2" is deep...there's a lot of sap in your pan at 2 inches. On my Mason 2x4 it takes about 100 gallons just to sweeten the pan...but I run it real low (about an inch).

[Tater]

Jbutton nailed it. You are running too deep. At 2" deep, you can hardly get enough sugar to make syrup. Stop adding sap, and let it get down to 3/4" (or lower if your pan is perfectly level and you are willing to do so). When you reach the lowest depth you are comfortable with, start adding sap again. Boiling without adding sap will cause the sugar to mix back through the pan. Adding sap again will push the sugar back toward the draw off. You will want to be adding sap fast enough to gradually raise the level in the pan, but not so fast as to get too deep before syrup density is reached (drawing off will lower level in pan and there will be a violent bubbling going on at syrup temperature).

Don't worry about having ruined your sap. Your hydrometers are working exactly as they are supposed to. Sap hydrometer maxes out at 12% and the syrup doesn't float til like 45%, so you will naturally have a large gap there. IMHO it takes longer to raise boiling temp the first degree than it does to raise it the other 6 (can't verify that, but it seems to work that way).

[jbutton]

I had the same problem my first time boiling with my continous flow pan. Couldn't get it there. My father in law said how deep you running,I said 1.5 to 2.he said lower it to 3/4 to 1.boy what a difference

[Mikemartin274]

Thank you all! Everyone was correct I have no power at shack it's going to cost $80000. Hopefully next year. I have no blower and was nervous it wouldn't work without, followed everyone's advice. Took my level down to 1-1.5 inches and bam immediate change in bubbles temp goes way up. Had A really great feeling inside. Drew off almost a gallon! Little less than hour later I drew off again and continued on until out SAP. Three draw offs total first one almost gallon the other little more then pint. You all helped so I'm thankful.

Two more questions while I have your attention. While drawing off the level was so low the valve wouldn't not flow 100% is this normal? Next question is how many boils or hours can I go before washing the pan out? All that niter concerns me. Thanks in advance.

[Tater]

For your first question, it depends on how low your draw off is mounted. We have a 1/2" draw off mounted almost right at the bottom of the pan (should have gone with 3/4). We typically don't open the valve all the way anyhow, but rather let it trickle out and into our prefilter setup. You probably will want to open it up all the way at first to clean out any niter build-up. Slowing the rate also decreases the chance that you draw out too much and scorch the pan by getting too shallow. The big guys typically try to set their valves to be constantly drawing syrup off without having to ever close it, rather than opening the valve all the way. I don't think you'll be able to evaporate that much in a 2x4, but if you do, don't tell anyone besides me and maybe I'll give you a small cut of the profit I make selling your idea! :lol:

As far as how long between cleanups, our pan often has to sit for a number of days due to weather or work. We let a couple gallons of nearup spoil when we left it in the pan for about a week even though temps stayed below freezing (freezing for water, but not syrup), so we started emptying the pan and cleaning it any time we expected more than 3 days between boils. We found a pan that is clean inside and out boils faster, so that's another upside to cleaning. We never had enough niter to cause serious issues, but we never boiled more than 20 hours between cleanings.

[Mikemartin274]

Thanks tater! Ended up getting about 2.5 gallons of syrup after finishing. It was really dark grade b. I think it tastes amazing. If I get to boil again this year I'd like to make a higher grade. I know their won't be SAP for at least a week so I'm going to clean pan.

I'm almost certain I ended up with b grade from cooking way longer than needed. I was saving the concentrate for the next boil. Is it possible to put the nearup that made b grade back in the pan and draw off a grade a light amber after? Should I just cook down nearup and start over? I've only got 25 gallons of SAP right now and don't know how much longer the season will continue. Have a good day!

[lastwoodsman]

My 2 x 4 Pan with 2% sap not ro'ed can take 300 gallons before I get a draw off. This week-end we had a 200 gallons and did not ro it as it would have reduced to far for the evaporator. Of course we got another 150 of 2% --should have ro'ed from the start. But it is not unusual to eat up 300 gallons of 2% without a drawoff. The next 400 it will come steady as the pans are sweet now.

[mellondome]

Most small blowers do not use much electricity. For 2 years I used an inverter to power the sugarhouse lights and blower on my 2x6.

[Tater]

I don't know enough about what makes syrup dark or light, but I think a couple factors are bacteria, how long the sap has sat (maybe related to bacteria?), number of times heated, and various weather related things. Our first syrup of the year was as dark as our darkest last year (I don't grade my syrup or know or care how it's done). Every other batch this year was really dark. That said, we preferred the dark stuff, so you might want to stick with that.

I'm not sure how much difference length of time boiling makes, because we made some really light syrup last year boiling in a pan on the electric range (before we made our 2x4 pan).

[Mikemartin274]

Hello all!
Just wanted to say thanks again for your help. When I originally wrote this thread I was disappointed and puzzled to say the least those of you who replied so fast played a role in this year's success.

update:
The other day I fired up for the 4th time, 5th tomorrow. My fourth boil was 9 hours and 130 or so gallons of SAP. Started with clean unsweetened pan looking for lighter grade syrup. Took four hours for first draw off and drew off three times total. Ended up with 1.3 gallons of light grade a. I'm really starting to appreciate the art of the draw off. SAP ran hard today got well over 200 gallons off 150+- Taps.going start boiling at 3 a.m. this is the most SAP I have ever had in my life wicked excited hoping to cook off what I got inside 12 hrs.

Hope your all sugaring well. Happy Easter!