Copper pan building

[jamiesonmaple]

I just ordered a copper roll of 24 gauge 3ftx10ft and will be soon building my copper flue pan. I was just wondering whats the difference between boiling rates between copper vs. stainless. I know for stainless its about 1sq ft = 1 gph of evaporation, but whats for the copper ratio? Copper is my best route because its really easy to work with and its cheaper for me. Its going to be a 2x3 flue pan with 6in flues.

[Sugarmaker]

Copper should be better!:) Lot of other factors to the boiling rate. Post some pictures of your build. That is a good sized project! Have fun.
Regards,
Chris

[Daveg]

At 225C' the thermal conductivity of copper is 298 and stainless is 19!
Please show pictures of the project, especially the bending process!
Good luck!
Regards,
Dave

[jamiesonmaple]

11968

This is a long process. I made the bend by clamping a piece of wood on top and folding it by my hands. I then took a rubber hammer and made a crisp edge. I'm making 6 flues 6inches deep and using the whole 3x10 sheet. I'm gonna need another role for the sides.

[Sugarmaker]

Looks like a good start!
Regards,
Chris

[Daveg]

Cool. Looking good. Will you use a torch,or an iron to do the soldering?

[Daveg]

Your bending rig looks like it's made from............curly maple!

[jamiesonmaple]

11979
I just finished tonight and I'm going to order more copper for the sides. I'm going to be torch soldering the sides. I could of spent more time on the brake but didn't want too because it would be a one time thing. After I build the flue pan I'm going to build the 2x3 front flat pan with dividers. I hope this 2x6 setup gets at least 40gph after I add the preheater. So far the sheet only cost me $185. By the way I'm only 17:D

[WMF]

You may want to use a heavier gauge for the flue ends and front pan, They are what will take a beating and be easy to damage.
When Leader made soldered flue pans they cut a separate piece to drop down into each flue end and then also folded and pounded flat each vertical edge over into a locking seam. They ended up with at least two layers of metal at each flue end and then flowed solder into the entire joint inside and out.
Someone may have some old Leader literature that explained it better and showed each step in pics.
Make sure to bend a reinforcing channel along the top edges of pan to keep flexing at a minimum when handling pan. Better yet make a SS tube frame and wrap copper around it.
Corners of pans really should have some sort of locking seam not just butted up and soldered. Should be easy to do with soft copper.

[jamiesonmaple]

For both pans I plan on double folding the top edges and I'm adding 2 dividers to help strengthen the whole pan. For the sides, all the edges would be folded over so the solder can get a good bond. Since copper is such a good conductor for heat, I don't think it will hurt to add 90 degree angle iron under the pan to help support and protect the pan. I wanna go thicker but copper is expensive. I'm kind of curious what leader did for the copper pans they built back then.

[Sugarmaker]

The angle iron may or may not work as a stiffener. The heat from the fire may weaken and soften the steel.
The flues look real good. If you can find the old soldering irons and get comfortable using them, they can work very well for this project. You would need a heat source to keep several hot on a project this size.
Regards,
Chris

[jamiesonmaple]

Finally had some extra time on my hands to finish one side. The hardest part was to fold the all the seems and to get them lined up. This was my first time soldering too.

[n8hutch]

I'd say you did a damb fine job. Maybe you could solder some 3/8 copper pipe around the top to stiffen your sides? That's going to be a boiling rig when you finish.

[jamiesonmaple]

I still have to build the the 2x3 front pan with dividers but that should be a piece of cake compared to the flue pan. I'm hoping to get 50 gph with aof and a preheater/hood.

[jamiesonmaple]

For the sides I'm folding it twice and leaving it at a 90 degree bend. I'm not to worried about the strength of the sides because the hood is going to be just touching the sides. The hood is going to be hanging from the ceilings from 4 small chains.

[jamiesonmaple]

Finally finished the flue pan :)

[morningstarfarm]

THAT ROCKS!!!!!!...unfortunately, I see a small problem...That pan is going to be volcanic when you are boiling...it needs to be deeper..probably twice as deep...can you extend the sides up?

[jamiesonmaple]

I hope the 7 inch sides are big enough haha. I'm also going to be adding a hood

[mellondome]

A hood wont keep sap in the pan. It will funnel it down the gutter to the drain. You could add splash guards to help .

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

Need at least 14 to 15 inch sides or a large splash guard that is on the WSE pans all around entire outside of the pan.

[jamiesonmaple]

Almost done!! Just have to add one more valve and bend the top of the flat pan so it has 90 degree edges:D

[BlueberryHill]

Looks great. Let us know what your end up with for a boil rate.

[psparr]

If it boils as well as I think it will, you'd better raise the sides of that flue pan. Your gonna lose a lot of sap.

[SmellsLikeSyrupNH]

Im very impressed!!! We need more 17yr olds that are this motivated and diligent to do this sort of work and less of them playing Xbox.

Congrats, I am curious about the splash rate though as well, also you are gonna need a HELL of a lot of sap to get that thing fed with 40gph evaporation rate. Gonna be badass though if it all works out!

[esetter]

Very nice work. The heat transfer should be really good too. I get excited when the sap starts turning that golden color. You shouldn't have to wait long boiling on that shiny copper!

[pennslytucky]

Looks great! Keep track of your costs and let us know please!

[jamiesonmaple]

I've spent around $500 dollars building these pans. The copper was 3ftx10ft for $185. I had bought two of these and I probably spent around $70 in solder. Its worth building if your crafty with your hands and you don't feel like spending $3000 for a new one.:lol:

[maple75]

Great work, can't wait to hear how it works for you. What kind of solder did you use?

[pennslytucky]

Probably can't even buy lead solder anymore. Not that you want to. I am interested in more info too. Solder, techniques for joinery and corners etc. I have a 3x12 arch that I was going to scrap, but now you have me thinking I should build a nice set this summer. Please put up some more pics when you get time?

[pyro]

With this project looking as nice as it does why is everyone not using copper? Certainly looks much easier to work with. Any negative health issues with using copper especially as it oxidizes or the soldering (assuming lead free)?

[jamiesonmaple]

Soldering this pan was a pain. I used a propane torch to solder the seems because a iron wouldnt get hot enough. This much copper caused the heat to be sucked right out of the copper. The best tip I can give to you if you try this is measure and plan ahead. You have to make sure the copper seams inter-lock each other because thats where all your strength comes from. In my opinion I think copper pans are worth it for small evaporators because you can clean them much easier. If I went any bigger I would have a hard time cleaning and making the bends for the pan because I only used a small seamer tool.

[Flealie]

Absolutely top notch craftsmanship. What kind of solder did you use? Regular lead free plumbing solder on a roll? I interested in doing something very similar. Please let us know how the copper pans work out for you. Being a plumber I like the look of copper over stainless.

[maple75]

Looking forward to hear how it works. I was considering building one. Thinking of using silfos. What type of solder did you use?

[Woody77]

Do you have better pictures of your hems, and how did you make them? Can you take the time to post a materials list , and where you sourced your copper.and good jobon those pans. I'm a contractor and I would hire you in a heartbeat based on your pictures. Be honest dI'd you have help besides u-tube.