Fall tapping

[Jebediah]

Is anybody planning on doing any fall tapping?

[Daveg]

Is anybody planning on doing any fall tapping?

I'm already tapped.............because I never took mine down! Just kidding, though I found out 2 weeks ago that I missed one of my 178 milk jugs.
Nah, no fall tapping. Keep us informed how it's going if YOU do, Jebediah!

[Jebediah]

That would probably be the end of my marriage...

[buckeye gold]

Yes I will be fall/early winter tapping. The runs will be more sporadic and a bit smaller, but the syrup is just as good as spring syrup. I don't start until the weather is consistantly cool. For southern Ohio that is about 10 days before Christmas and I can run until early to mid January. In a warm year I never stop until spring. You can only get about a month until taps start to heal and sap flow drops, because we get to many warm days. I move to new trees when sap flow diminishes in mid January. You can not tap the same tree fall and spring. It saved my butt last year as spring was bad and I made almost half my syrup from December 8th to January 15th.

[Newbie18]

Does fall tapping generally give a light or darker syrup?

[buckeye gold]

perhaps a bit darker just because sometimes it get's warmer, if weather stays cool syrup will be same as spring

[delstele]

Never thought tapping in the fall.. I may just try it this year...

[MapleMark753]

We will be doing it again this late fall. If its your first time just be aware that sap yield and sugar percentage is likely to be less than regular season (on gravity anyway). Does make same good syrup tho. Like Buckeye mentioned too, ours has been a bit darker than regular season.

[buckeye gold]

Is anyone fall tapped yet? I think i will put my fall taps out the second week of December. The weather is just right now and tempting, but I figure we'll get another warm spell, after that I'm in. I cleaned and set up the shack last Friday, and ordered supplies. I'm all ready to go.

[foxtailsugary]

glad im not the only one that cant wait till spring. im going to setup some new fall lines later today and tapping late this week. plan about 30 taps. just enough to have fun. i boiled till dec 28 last year

[maplefrank]

Gathered 200+ gallons sap today.... 3/16 tubing

[MapleMark753]

Got a bunch in yesterday (60's here)... but weather looks mapleish the next 10 days at least so a couple hundred more today and tomorrow. I'd say half were running yesterday. We thought the fall fever was cured last year, but I guess not...here we go!...at least for 2-3 weeks til it freezes up hard for the winter.
I'm not testing individual trees this time, just aggregate sap. Last fall season it was 1.4 to 1.75 I think, compared to regular season of 2 plus. Gotta rinse tanks and the evap. and we will be ready to go. No RO for the fall stuff, so lots of boiling. :D
take care Mark

[buckeye gold]

It's deer gun season here (Ohio) this coming week, so I'm not going to be in the woods tapping. The weather looks right for the following week so I will tap then or the week after. Everything is ready to go.

[MapleMark753]

Yeah...same here with Deer season...hunt a bit, tap a bit in another area. Neighbor was out but knows I tap on our property and has a sense of humor about it. Silent woods (cept for me tapping) and cough, cough, a**hole, cough, cough...softly in the distance. We only do a couple to a few hundred taps for late fall, I don't know anyone who does it on a large scale, maybe some here do. I always say its pretty marginal, but still worth it for us.

[MapleMark753]

Almost all the late fall tapping is done now, almost all trees were dripping yesterday. As there was no wind, you could hear the drips all around you like rain.
There's a few that are just flat out dry. Spring, summer, and fall they look normal and healthy, albeit with not so large crowns. Anyone know why this happens, or if there's anything to look for to avoid it prior to tapping it?
take care, Mark

[buckeye gold]

I have seen the same thing over the years Mark, but have not figured it out. I totally leave the reds alone in the fall, as I get such poor flow from them. I have determined that it's best to stay with trees over 16" DBH in the fall as well. Last year I thought I had something figured out with deep woods trees and field trees. My deep woods trees done better in the fall, so I will watch again this fall to see if that holds true. I think the edge trees get warmed more and the sap stays up. Conversely those are my best trees in spring so I'm ahead to not fall tap those. Man if we could figure this out we'd have something. However; I see dry trees right in the middle of a cluster of high performers in the fall, so something is up with those trees. I marked some last year and I will be interested to see if they are dry again this year, that will tell me it's the tree.

[MapleMark753]

I guess personal notes on specific trees and experience will tell over a few seasons. With lower sap yield and percent sugar for late fall tapping, each tree is more important for us. For regular spring season I don't think I have even one dry tap hole other than the hitting non conductive wood deal once in a while. On the bright side, should have enough to collect and boil tonight or tomorrow so that'll be good. Be interesting to see if its dark like usual fall syrup or what.

[MapleMark753]

Its straight up dark-robust syrup, no off flavors, good tasting stuff. Sugar content so far is about 1.7 percent, includes silvers and some sugars.
But, I always get pumped, then slightly bummed at the about 1/3 volume of sap as compared to regular season. New house roof took the tubing and vacuum budget for this year, be interesting to compare results with tubing and a guzzler type deal next fall. Hope its better, should be.
take care, Mark

[buckeye gold]

I done my final setup in the sugar house today, sterilized the head tank and washed every pan and utensil I own. set up and ran my blower for a while. I mounted 50 bags on PVC holders yesterday. Now I'm trying to decide when to tap, I may do some trial trees today. I'm starting with 50 and if it goes well may go as high as 100 taps.

[220 maple]

Last week I noticed a walnut tree dripping from a broken limb. The weather has been near perfect for fall tapping if anyone was interested doing it, Mid 20's at night high 40's to low 50's in the daytime!

Mark 220 Maple

[Marvel26]

I'm in a bit of a quandary on fall tapping vs spring tapping.

Last spring was my first real attempt at making syrup and all season I had maybe 2 or 3 days of good temperature fluctuations to get sap flowing. I have been watching the temp all fall and I have had over a month of frosty nights -5 to -7C and plus days +5 to +8C.....I have no idea what the sugar content would be on my trees in the fall but I got 2% or a little more in the spring. A little math would lead me to believe that a month or more of 1% is still way better than a few days at 2%+.....

My question to you all is: Does anyone find that they get a better yield with fall tapping than with spring tapping?

Thanks

Rob

[buckeye gold]

My question to you all is: Does anyone find that they get a better yield with fall tapping than with spring tapping?


a short simple answer...NO

typically less sap and lower sugar. You can't tap the same trees again in the spring either. It will make you some syrup but you need extra trees and you'll have a shorter fall season.

[MapleMark753]

I agree with Buckeye in all he said, would just add that its ALWAYS lower sugar content and amount of sap for fall tapping. For us anyways.

True experts have said that sap volume for fall tapping can approach normal season levels with tubing and high vacuum. We have neither of those yet so can't comment really.

[unc23win]

A little math would lead me to believe that a month or more of 1% is still way better than a few days at 2%+.....

My question to you all is: Does anyone find that they get a better yield with fall tapping than with spring tapping?

Thanks Rob

Ok well in your case maybe fall tapping is better. If I read your post right you basically are saying that you are finding that the temperatures in the spring aren't right and that you might get more runs in the fall and more sap than you would in the spring and basically you get next to nothing in the spring. Correct? Well then maybe you should try it and see.

I see in the other fall tapping post that Spud is over 10 gallons per tap some sugar is 2% and some isn't as good. Well in my opinion if you are comparing no sap (spring) to sap (fall) maybe you should try the fall thing. I would think it might be similar if say a person had a job out the country that started March 1 and lasted until May 1 they wouldn't get any sap in the spring, but they were able to do it in the fall they might want to get whatever sap they can. Also not to make anyone mad, but I am not sure how well New Brunswick compares to Ohio for fall weather.

[maplefrank]

Gathered three hundred gallon today...

[WESTMAPLES]

maplefrank how many are you tapping and whats your sugar content ?? fall tapping interests me

[Marvel26]

Jared,

Local weather differences is the root of my question, I am near the Bay of Fundy which moderates the weather....ALOT. I can literally watch the snow on the ground deepen as I drive inland from the shore. Last spring was horrible for snow largest on record for over 100 yrs so I may do better this spring. Also, I have only one season to look at so perhaps I'm being a bit of a Henny Penny too.

[maplefrank]

maplefrank how many are you tapping and whats your sugar content ?? fall tapping interests me. Not sure how many tapped??? Maybe 200??? Tapped few more today until broke bit..... The sap last week was around one..,

[MapleMark753]

We had a couple of very poor "runs" of about a quart per tap to half gallon per tap. The night temps are just a tad above (30-32F) how cold I'd like it to be (27F). The taps are in so we'll keep boiling as it comes. Makes it a bit tricky for boiling for us as its not really enough to do a regular boiling session (4-6 hours for us), so I do a quick sterilize it boil and then a finish boil the next run/day. The last aggregate sap was 1.9 percent, which is about the highest I have seen here, but still lower than regular season. I'd guess that it will fluctuate back down a bit.
Just anecdotally, I have seen that tapping the south side only of our trees, whether silvers or sugars, seems to help for fall tapping, and that 4 hours of good sun will produce an ok run. There's enough trees to alternate years tapping them, I know only doing the south side is not optimal. The silvers in particular increase in diameter pretty quickly.
take care, Mark

[MapleMark753]

We will get to make some syrup again today, yea! Our little "secret" in late fall tapping isn't the not optimal yield. Its the nearly universal response when I give out samples in town or wherever. Nobody expects late fall tapping, all are surprised that you do, and it leads to customers we'd not otherwise have. :) So, its a good tool for both education and marketing for us. I'm surprised more don't do it, especially if they have separate trees, tubing, and high vacuum available.
take care, Mark

[buckeye gold]

I have been sitting waiting with a loaded gun, so to speak, but the weather just will not cooperate with me. It looked like the next week would be good and now a warming trend is coming. I put out three test taps and had one small run on one day and that was about a half gallon between three taps. My best guess is I won't be in until just before Christmas now. That actually may work in my favor as I'll just leave those taps out through January. This warmer weather is hurting fall tapping, but in the long run it may work out to more syrup. I think it was around 2010-2011 I made syrup from Christmas clear through January and then moved to my spring woods with only like a week off. I'm still getting pretty impatient to start this thing. I have everything ready all I need is sap!

[MapleMark753]

Yeah, weather here too has not been as predicted. We'll see. The Silvers though, do run with just a cold night, not a hard freeze, like say when its 31-33 degrees at night followed by 40ish with sun for a few hours. We're in, ready, want more, its tough waiting. Good dark syrup again from the last I boiled.
Hope somebody who is all in for late fall tapping is having stellar production! From the "sound" of it I don't think more than a handful of people do it at all. None do right around us.
take care, Mark

[MapleMark753]

Weather doesn't look good for the next week, too warm. But, made some good Very Dark early this AM, first time ever for very dark. Honestly, tastes about the same as Dark, just a tad over the color mark for dark. I had thought very dark might be hard to filter, and may have unwanted flavor, but it filtered ok, is clear, and tastes good. Man, hope we get some good freeze thaws soon. Might be making Christmas syrup, dunno yet.
take care, Mark

[MapleMark753]

The trees did quit running, supposed to be record warm here today (66 or so). This will give me time to mark some more trees and to mark the ones that didn't run at all. Then I'll put another few dozen taps in by Friday, and that will be all for this year, maybe get a few more small runs in. :)
So, I do need a suggestion. The several hundred bags are empty. BUT still have some wet residue. Anybody have any experience with this small residue going bad and contaminating the next run? I have enough bags to replace ones that get holes but not several hundred, unless I go into the regular seasons supply. thanks
take care, Mark

[buckeye gold]

Maple Mark,

I've had the same thing and hate to waste bags. Last year I brought a bunch in and turned them inside out and dunked them in a light chlorine wash and rinsed with hot water. I then hung them on a clothes line to dry. I turned them back and reused them in the regular season and never had any problems. Now if they had sap in them through the regular fall tapping I tossed them.

[MapleMark753]

That sounds like it would do it. Thanks for the suggestion.

[MapleMark753]

On just a little reflection, I think I'll do your idea buckeye, but try it with hydrogen peroxide and a good water rinse like I do on the tote and tanks. Gonna take a coupla days but any maple time is good time. For the most part (humor).
Mark

[buckeye gold]

Either one will work, they both should rinse well and any residue will gas off fairly quickly. Hydrogen Peroxide (H202) is an oxidizer so should do a nice job on any residual organic matter.

[buckeye gold]

had a run last night of about a half gallon per tap, but it has warmed up too fast and the run won't last. The next few days are forecast to be unseasonably warm, so it looks like no more sap this week. Now I have a pan full of sweet and I think my only option is to drain it and finish it all on propane. The extended forecast for southern Ohio looks like the first of week of January will be rocking sap weather. I really am feeling like I will have taps out and do periodic boils from now till spring, it's looking more like a repeat of 2011-2012 winter all the time.

[MapleMark753]

Yeah, we too had a similar small run of just shy of a half gallon per tap. Could be encouraging or discouraging depending on how you look at it I guess. But, its some syrup we didn't have before. Attached is a pic of one of the bags on a Silver.12227

[buckeye gold]

i'm amazed; I thought the warm temps would shut the trees down but I have a run again this morning, that's four days in a row at 50+ degrees and lows in the 40s. Not big runs, but still sap....I'll not complain about making syrup. With the warm it's all been dark syrup, but nice tasting.

[Windy Acres]

We are trying the fall tapping this yeat, only on trees that we can't get to in the spring, we had a decent run yesterday /last night, we got almost 100 gallons, we boiled it off today, that was the first sap on our new evaporator 122441224512246

[MapleMark753]

Nice to hear others have and are doing the fall tapping. Our fall tapping is done as of today, made a couple of gallons with last nights meager run. Neighbor was out walking his dog, saw me collecting and a good conversation about maple took place. I think he'll be over to get some the day after Christmas. Probably going to blend todays syrup and grade and bottle tomorrow (Christmas Blend!). We learned a bit more this fall (for us its another whole separate season) with successes and a coupla "oops" too. Our Silvers are very fickle, will run one year and not the next. No boil overs for the first time, and it was fun but not too profitable. Good for marketing though. The weather looks like it will permit a good clean up b4 new years. I've been just using the Lapierre clear 5/16 straight seasonal spouts on bags, I've been wondering if another tap will give maybe better results as well as keep the bags on the taps in a big wind. Anybody on that?
take care,

Mark

[MapleMark753]

I guess we'll stick with what we're using then, I'll see what the CDL store people say when I stop down there to get a couple boxes of bags, hopefully for the last time! ...tubing next season... :)
take care, Mark

[buckeye gold]

Well my fall season is about over. The forecast is for good sap weather this weekend and then cold. The temps have been so radically up and down and way too many warm days to make it a good fall season. This is probably my worse fall/early winter season yet. Runs would start then quit or run and sap would spoil. many of my tap holes dried out and quit. I am going to try and get a boil this weekend then pull taps and clean up. I plan on moving to my main woods and do my regular spring taps the end of January, probably around the 25th. with this weekend I will have boiled 5 times and dumped sap three times. All the syrup I made was dark, but rich flavored. I did not make enough to fill any early orders, but I made the family happy with enough syrup for the Holidays. Here's hoping spring goes better.

[Red-bellied Woodpecker]

Going to give fall tapping a try tbis year here in WI. Seeing it is looking like i will be able to get access to more trees then i can get to in spring I figure why the heck not. My thoughts is 1. Yes I know sugar is lower along with less sap per tap but I feel some sugar is better then none. 2 Its my slow time of the year and if i can kick out a few gal syrup...well that can help with paying for filter press and new bottler for next spring. Time will tell if this becomes a normal thing for me.