VT Sugaring operation with 90,000+ taps...

[mwarren]

Check out this story about possibly the largest sugaring operation in the world...


http://www.wcax.com/story/29065674/mega-maple

[jmayerl]

They have a lot of expanding to do to say they are the biggest.........plenty of comercial operations bigger than that.

[wiam]

Supposedly they are headed for the biggest. I have heard 300,000

[David in MI]

I'm expecting to see them posting here asking if we think they'll be profitable if they add another 50,000 taps. :lol:

On a serious note, I would really enjoy a tour of their facilities. Looks like they went with all CDL equipment.

[DrTimPerkins]

On a serious note, I would really enjoy a tour of their facilities. Looks like they went with all CDL equipment.

A tour of the Sweet Tree operation (and other sites) will be included as part of the Vermont MapleRama Summer Tour. It is a very impressive facility (both the plant and the woods operation). I can't speak for them, but I got the impression during our visit that they don't like to have individuals or groups just show up unannounced at their door looking for a tour.

It appeared to be exclusively CDL equipment. Very well designed and installed systems.

From what we heard, they are planning to continue to expand (add taps) for the foreseeable future. They have the potential to go to 400-500,000 taps. The tree resource is there and the plant is big enough to deal with that kind of volume.

[palmer4th]

25% concentrate...

[Wanabe1972]

25% concentrate... I was thinking the same thing I think they meant after there RO 25 percent of there sap was left as concentrate. Boy I think my RO s toungue should be hanging out if I ever tried that.

[GeneralStark]

Nope. They mean 25% concentrate.

[Wanabe1972]

I didnt even know you could go that high. After watching this video even though im all for advancements and inovations ie. vacuum, RO, oil fired evap. something pisses me off about this place. I guess the old wood fired evap in an adirondack sided shack with an old dog laying in the corner is my cup of tea. I guess i may have trouble with the changing of the times. Are they going to set up a small nuclear reactor for the next evaporator?

[jrmaple]

I don't really agree with their RO set-up, concentrating to 25% and then transporting it; they don't say how far they are transporting it or how long it is kept as concentrate before being boiled, but with that high of sugar content and having to transport it and etc just gives it time to spoil. I guess I am in the same boat, maple syrup can be a business or a small business or a hobby, but at that level it is just not for enjoyment. But thats just me and I like the family run, keep it local aspect… 10,000 or 30,000 taps is one thing, this scale just is unreal...

[Wanabe1972]

Im not saying there is anything wrong with what they are doing. I just have worked for a big company for 20 years that was not so big when i started and i think there was alot of pride in what we did here. We always looked for a way to make our product better and steamline production. Now it seems all we do is look for some way to save money and our product is pretty good but boy are we making money. My production of syrup is very small backyard operation. I make about 20 gallons ayear just enough for my family a few freinds and try to sell enough to break even on any cost or updates ive made for the year. I pride myself on every drop of syrup i make. If its off taste it gets dumped. This company is not looking for a blue ribbon for taste but a huge bottom line and a ribbon of green (money) Theres nothing wrong with making money at this as hopefully one day when im retired i will be able to pad my income from some syrup sales. And as far as going to wholesale for value added products that sounds good now but what if they dont get contracts for the syrup do you think there are going to sit on 50 thousand gallons of syrup untl they have contracts? They will cut it free and flood the market and your gallon of blue ribbon made with pride syrup will be worth 20 dollars.

[wdchuck]

If these guys actually stay with value added product, its a pretty good deal for all of us,.....BUT, do we believe that? My concern is that the day will come when this group changes direction and creates their own distribution division and starts dumping product on the market.......RIGHT IN MY BACKYARD!!

[Flat Lander Sugaring]

25% is nothing, H2O has a operation that takes theirs to 40% and then simmers the sap. I wish I had tasted it but A.D.D. took over I forgot to go get a cup.

Think overhead people, how can they sell their syrup as cheap as a little guy?

[n8hutch]

I Think That these Large producers will not greatly lower prices in the Immediate future. I do however think that they will keep supply high so our current prices probably won't keep Pace with Inflation. In other words 20 years from now the bulk price of syrup will still be around 2.50$ a pound.

Think about the Big Dairy farms in vt or the mid west. You better believe they are getting the same price per hundred as the little farms. That's why they spend like crazy when the price of milk is high.like last year. Pretty sure the price is back down now.

Best you can hope for is for a strong Canadian dollar so we get more for our syrup on this side of the line. Not sure that is good for the rest of our economy. Sure seems to help syrup Maker's out though.

[palmer4th]

All I meant by the 25% was it seems high to make good tasting syrup. However i also have never tasted it. Im Sure they cant let it sit for long. It was amazing the engeneering that whet into that set up though.

[eagle lake sugar]

Corporate sugarbushes won't affect my little operation as I sell everything locally. I would be concerned though, if I were a bulk producer in Vt. or N.Y. etc. We've seen it happen in other industries, such as potato and dairy farming. What usually happens, is the huge outfits slowly gobble up the competition. For example, they install very costly climate controlled processing facilities and because they have political clout, force legislation through that mandates that other producers have the same equipment. I hope I'm wrong and everything works out for the best.

[Mel]

A tour of the Sweet Tree operation (and other sites) will be included as part of the Vermont MapleRama Summer Tour.



When is that?

I really need to get my passport renewed....

[BreezyHill]

When looking at the big picture...more supply will over supply demand and drive prices down.

Hate to break it to you but the local store with local suppliers will be affected. For local stores to survive it takes a very good marketing program. One must always be adding customers to survive the customer(s) that fall by the wayside or just have to cut back.

When I graduated high school minimum wage was $3.15 diesel was .99/gal. Now minimum is $7+ and diesel is 2.99. If minimum is pushed to $15 then fuel will soon be $5 or higher. With this pricing how much will it cost to make a gallon of syrup; between hauling sap, tubing, and evaporator fuel.

Minimum wage is not a sustenance point but t he first step from school onto the ladder of life and wage earning.

Trickle Down Economics, affects us all.

[wiam]

When is that?

I really need to get my passport renewed....

July 23-25

[Daveg]

The last three years' totals of US and Vermont sugaring (in 1000 gals.)
............. US. VT
2012 1908. 750
2013. 3523. 1480
2014. 3167. 1320

Even if 100,000 gallons were "dumped", it wouldn't have near the economic impact as the weather did two years ago, or every year for that matter.

[markct]

Well said Daveg i also hear everyone worked up everytime there is mention of a new 100,000 tap operation yet i bet theres easily 20 operations of 5k taps that silently pop up each year too. Its a business folks. If everyone was in it for nostalgia we would have a huge maple shortage!

[220 maple]

I thought we had a maple shortage? there is only 68 million pounds in the cartels warehouse, that won't last long! oh by the way pure organic quart at Costco 12.181 today

[DrTimPerkins]

When looking at the big picture...more supply will over supply demand and drive prices down.

In a pure market-driven economy, that is the way it works. In the short-term (a few years), maple isn't quite that simple, due to the fact that the major portion of the market supply is controlled (in Quebec via quotas), and that there is a surplus which mediates that supply. Given that the prices are generally set a year (or even two) ahead of time in Quebec, the U.S. price doesn't stray far from the Quebec price with the currency exchange rate factored in. In the long-term, if U.S. production continues to rise, there may well be more of a market-driven pricing structure at the bulk and retail level. That is, unless the Federation decides to do something to address either the growth in the U.S. What that might be is unknown....but you can bet that they're thinking about it.

The most likely scenario (in my mind at least) is that rapid U.S. production and large crops could reduce the bulk price in the U.S. BELOW the Federation price, which not only hurts U.S. producers, but also threatens the Federation price structure if packers continue to purchase more U.S. origin syrup and reduce Federation purchases. At this point however, markets for maple are quite strong, so the high levels of production are being absorbed. That is really the strength of the stability in price and supply that is afforded by Federation policies, although there are certainly people who don't like that control. In the U.S. we benefit from that stability, but aren't constrained by quotes, thus U.S. production is growing. At this point we have the best of both worlds.....that's not saying that it'll continue this way indefinitely though.

I don't want people to think that I see the Federation as the "big bad wolf" in any way. Their policies have certainly stabilized the price structure for all producers, and have stabilized the supply side for marketers and purchasers of maple syrup. The lack of that in many ways was what kept maple syrup from becoming more of a main-stream sweetener. Big industrial buyers just can't deal with even modest price fluctuations and constraints in supply from year-to-year. On the flip side, they (the Federation) certainly would like to control the markets and supply in both Canada and the U.S. to the highest degree possible.

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

From the meetings I was in last month, they are predicting US to be out producing Quebec in 5 to 10 years.

[DrTimPerkins]

From the meetings I was in last month, they are predicting US to be out producing Quebec in 5 to 10 years.

Wishful thinking. If U.S. syrup production grows at an exponential rate, then we may match (current) Canadian production somewhere around 25-40 years. Of course this doesn't factor in any response(s) that Quebec (and maple producers in other Canadian Provinces) may make in response, both in terms of their own production, syrup prices, etc. We definitely have the tree resource in the U.S. to produce vast amounts of syrup, but it seems quite unlikely that growth in production and markets can continue indefinitely.

[sjdoyon]

Was that meeting in Colorado? :)


From the meetings I was in last month, they are predicting US to be out producing Quebec in 5 to 10 years.

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

I thought it was little too soon myself, but thought I would at least get some responses. LOL. Meeting was in Vermont last month, just couple hundred miles from Colorado.

[maple maniac65]

41% Article is in the Maple News at a VT sugar house