3/16 slope

[Forrest hunters]

I have read almost every post on the 3/16 line but very rarely see anything about slope before the drop to tank. Can you run 2-3% slope upline and would it be better to do a 90 from up in the air to the tank or have a 50 foot length of tubing drop 10-15 feet gradually drop into tank? I can't get 30 foot drop but can get some. May also try some more gradual slope next year too. Maybe long lines to get some slope though.

[Sandersyrup]

would it be better to do a 90 from up in the air to the tank or have a 50 foot length of tubing drop 10-15 feet gradually drop into tank? I

I assume a 90º drop from up high above the tank would increase the risk of losing head pressure better so go more gradual. but this is an assumption based on my observation in 3/16 drops. perhaps with more taps the tube may fill if so ultimately the angle matters less than the altitude drop.

[psparr]

The slope doesn't matter. It's the total fall that does.

[Paul VT]

The slope doesn't matter. It's the total fall that does.
I have found this also. Most of my taps are very flat. The drop after the last tap gives it the pull.

[PerryW]

The slope doesn't matter. It's the total fall that does.

I would be interested in seeing the math on this one. While the vacuum created by a column if liquid (sap) is dependent only on the "total fall", once the sap starts flowing, the dynamic frictional resistance would work against the vacuum forces.

[Forrest hunters]

So I could go with 1% slope on my tubing and just have more fall at the end? I would think I would need 2% minimum and maybe 3% with this small tubing.

[5050racing]

I have five trees together with five foot drop then just tubing 300' down another 25' drop to tank and 28" of vacuum !!read can't believe it photo is of gauge.and it RUNS can't post video with iPhone will try on iPad later send me your phone number and I will send video my first 3/16 install the rest is getting change out and use 1/2 main further down so to collect one tank they say 700' and still works with drop!

[VTmaplehobby]

Here is the link to the Proctor Maple Center's report on 3/16 tubing.

http://www.uvm.edu/~pmrc/3-16%20Tubing%20-%20Wilmot%20-%20Maple%20News%20Dec%202014a.pdf

The Vac is figured at .88" per foot of drop after the last tap, so 30' of vertical drop would give you ideal vac conditions if the line is full.

Hope this Helps.

[Forrest hunters]

I know about the vertical drop and the vac potential I just don't know what I should run from tree to tree before I hit the big drop at the end? Can I run 1, 2 3% then have as much drop as possibly after last tree?

[psparr]

I know about the vertical drop and the vac potential I just don't know what I should run from tree to tree before I hit the big drop at the end? Can I run 1, 2 3% then have as much drop as possibly after last tree?

That's exactly what you need. Mine varies from near nothing to maybe 3%. Then a gradual drop to my collection container. Another line has a steep drop at the end. Both produce wonderfully.

[eustis22]

If I only have two or three 3/16 runs down my slope (15-20 taps), do I need a mainline? Does it need to be 1 inch or can I use something narrower? Do I cap the end of the main that isn't emptying into my holding tank to maintain a vacuum?

[n8hutch]

I wouldn't bother with a main line, unless you have some crazy distance after your 30' drop, I would just run 3, 3/16 lines to the tank, your going to want probably 100 gal tank if you have 60 taps going to it, I have 17 taps on one run & it will fill a 55 gal barrel half full frequently,

[Maplesapper]

If I only have two or three 3/16 runs down my slope (15-20 taps), do I need a mainline? Does it need to be 1 inch or can I use something narrower? Do I cap the end of the main that isn't emptying into my holding tank to maintain a vacuum?

Based on UVM study; If this is natural vacuum on the 3/16th, I don't believe you will be able to maintain a natural vacuum in a 1" diameter tube.
The vacuum will be zero, at the point where the 3/16 tubing enters the 1" tubing.
If you cap the 1" it might be helpful to keep out bacteria.

Toss a vacuum gauge on 3\16 tubing to see if you are already getting the limit of the vacuum.

[eustis22]

oh, sorry if I inplied that this was an ongoing set up. Actually, I'm planning to replace my hill buckets with 3/16 for next year...my hill is a short steep pitch and then I'd bleed into a 55 gal drum at the bottom. The lines would cut a diagonal to a spot near the driveway that I will offload to. Since we're in the throes of the season and my mind is all about the maple I'm doing the designing now before even laying it out. Can I terminate each line in my holding barrel?

[n8hutch]

Yes, that's what you want to do, I have one line with 35 taps that terminates at A barrel probably 200ft from the last tap, maybe 12 percent slope, works great, pulling 25" vac,.

[Maplesapper]

We do the same.
Have 3 separate lines, each with 15-20 taps, emptying into individual 55 gallon drums.

[eustis22]

does someone have a pic of a pressure gauge setup on a 3/16 line?

[a.clarke]

First post in this thread.

http://mapletrader.com/community/showthread.php?25489-Can-t-believe-28-inches-of-vacuum-3-16

[eustis22]

thank you...I assume the gauge would go ABOVE the first drop....if I have 3 lines would I need three gauges? is the gauge treated like any other drop?

[Forrest hunters]

Okay. Thanks to all who hi-jacked my thread. There are many other threads in here which talk about the very topics being discussed above.

I still have not seen anything on slope other than okay at 1-3%. So if I shoot for 2% grade from starting tree then after last tree have a good drop to barrel I will be okay. Maybe able to get 10-15 feet after last drop.

How about for taps closer to barrel which will not have much drop? Should I run more slope? Basically dealing with a half bowl design where the bottom of the bowl is close to the road where I will need to pump sap to truck from.

[n8hutch]

My 17 tap run on 3/16 has very little slope between the taps a few places it is level, has a few sags , I put it up & down every year. Still pulls 16 inch's at the last tap hole,easily get over a gpt every day, only has a 15-20' drop after last tap.

[eustis22]

Touchy....

[Super Sapper]

You should be good with the 2% slope and drop afterward. As far as the taps on the bottom it should be ok as long as the line is not overloaded. I have the same type of setup but only 20 taps total and it works fine. If you have enough taps down lower you will be better off with 5/16 on those on a separate line.

[eustis22]

can you NOT have much drop after the last tap? mine may only be a foot or two at the bottom tree before the barrel.

[Forrest hunters]

I can have some drop, but some of my best producers are right down in the gulley near where the barrel will be. I will be able to get some drop, just have to drill up a little higher.

[n8hutch]

If your trees at the end of the run, closest to your collection tank will need to be tapped higher say at 5 to 6', you would be better served to put buckets on them & use the collection tank as a dump station, I think you will not get the potential out of those taps closest to your collection point with only 4-5 feet of drop. Your trees further up the hill will benefit from the 3/16 but your lower trees might be limited by it.

[kevins maple assistant]

I am pretty new also, but I don't think it matters your slope in the middle of the run as long as you get the vacuum started with good fall below the bottom few trees. I actually had some lines running uphill in the middle of runs (for access) and the sap just went up and over my utility vehicle crossing area at the same speed as it was in other areas. I put 400 plus taps on 3/16 with about 20 feet of fall below the first trees into the mainline and then ran up the hill in a zigzag for a total of 80 to 100'of fall. We had 17 lateral lines. Sometimes to get to a tree off to the side a bit the line was pretty flat or maybe uphill here also. We averaged over a gallon a day when things were running per tap for the entire year and our vacuum gauges were generally pegged at the maximum of 31.

[Ryan Mahar]

does someone have a pic of a pressure gauge setup on a 3/16 line?

Did you get a picture, or are these the same gauges we use on the mainlines for vacuum with just a reducer to fit the 3/16th??? Thanks.......

[Paul VT]

11755
D&G has the 3/8 NPT to 3/16 adapters.

[Ryan Mahar]

Great thanks!