Defoamer allergies

[markcasper]

Here is something I must share with all. I got a phone call this morning from a customer that recently purchased my syrup. They asked me if I had used lard as defoamer and then wanted to know what I use. I told the guy that I use Crisco and he then asked me if it had canola products in it. He then preceded to tell me that he has allergic reactions to canola and canola oil.
I had to call him back and went to investigate the Crisco container. Turns out it has soybean and cottonseed oil and no canola. I returned the call and left a message with the information.
Now I can see the writing on the wall with something like this. The day will come when we will have to list what we use as a defoamer. Much like the purchase of certain products. For example, alot of candy has disclaimers about the fact that the product was processed on equipment that was used to sort nuts, or something like that.
Just when you think things can't get any goofier, they do!

[maplehound]

It's for that very reason I use nothing but comercial defoamers. At least then if someone accuses me of making them sick from an alergic reaction, the defoamer producer will bear some of the blame, if not all. We have to protect ourselves as much as possible.

[tapper]

Oh wow now we must do health screenings of customers? With the small amount of defoamer I ever used I would find it hard to beleive there would be that much of it actually left in the syrup. That brings up the question of does it boil out or does it condense down and remain with the syrup?

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

Sounds like somebody needing money and looking for a reason to sue. All the more reason to carry product liability, just don't ever tell customers you carry it, just acted stupid if they ask so you don't encourage a lawsuit.

[markcasper]

I had witnessed one time late in the season where the commercial I was boiling did not want to tame down, no matter how much crisco went in. On that particular day, you could see a film on top of the finished syrup which was obviously the shortening. I had always heard that the defoamer always boiled away with the steam so long as it was used sparingly.
I will be looking at my insurance as I am a bit freaking out right now.

[Maple Hill Sugarhouse]

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[tapper]

Brandon,
I like the way you think.

[markcasper]

Oil slick?? I don't think so! I have never had a problem in taming syrup down with miniscule amounts of shortening. Like I said, commercial syrup boils like tar and that is the only one time that I ever witnessed the results of using too much. This also was on the top of unfiltered syrup. I believe that if it was put through the filter press, it would have been removed.

The syrup that this individual purchased was high medium amber and there was absolutely nothing wrong with it.

I might add that this syrup was sold from our local health food store in which I wholesale to. Not to offend anyone, but some of the people that service those types of stores are the ones that can make a mountain out of a molehill. Alot of the customers are overly-educated and INTO their food purchases, they know EVERYTHING and ANYTHING and are heavy into organics and being green. Not that thats bad, but I am just saying.
When I deliver syrup there I feel like a lightning bolt is going to hit me when I walk through the door. That is the kind of atmosphere I guess.

Other than being courteous and out-going to this individual, theres not much to say other than tell it like it is.

[802maple]

All this has just got to make us more aware of what we are putting in our syrup and how much. Since my wife is allergic to about every fruit on the planet and peanuts, I understand how a very small film of any of the above can send us to the hospital as it has several times. I do agree that some people will use any excuse they can to make a buck. That is why unless the sap is about to roll out of the pan, I don't use defoamer. Alot of sugarmakers aren't happy unless they have a constant flat pan and it doesn't gain them a thing other than using to much defoamer.

[Jim Brown]

Gentlemen ; another reason( as crazy as it seems ) to carry product liability insurance. With out it and one person like that( and an aggressive lawyer) will own your house.
just a thought
Jim

[Maple Hill Sugarhouse]

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[maple flats]

Exactly why I carry product liability ins. It is rather cheap peace of mind. It also covers my u-pick blueberry operation. I bought mine thru Farm Family, affiliated with Farm Bureau.

[mountainvan]

Mark, To bad about the poor quality customer. I'm sure you make top quality syrup, if not the folks in the health store would'nt carry it. I am most impressed by your honesty and forthrightness with your customer!! You're serving the maple industry well. I've never lost a customer telling them all about how I make maple syrup and what equipment, defoamer, etc. that is use, I've almost always made a friend.

[Russell Lampron]

Mark,

The customer probably had an allergic reaction to something and used your syrup, which wasn't the cause, in the time frame of when he had the reaction. Hopefully all he was doing was trying to eliminate that as the source so he can continue to enjoy the syrup he has left and not looking for a law suit.

What is the Atmos defoamer made of? I changed to canola oil last year because it doesn't solidify when it gets cold so I always know what to expect when I squirt some out of the bottle.

Russ

[Maple Hill Sugarhouse]

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[Russell Lampron]

Been thinking for while since my last post. The customer was definately a gold digger looking for a law suit. How many people other than maple producers know about the foam problem and the use of a defoamer of some sort? This guy even knew to ask if Mark was using lard! The guy is probably such an a--hole that his wife probably put canola oil in the pancake batter.

Russ

[Sugarmaker]

Why does the commercial defomer and canola oil smell the same to me? Seems they work about the same too? HuMMM. I don't have a clue what the commercial defomer is made from. The stuff I buy, they don't put a label on it? Just wondering?

Chris

[Maple Hill Sugarhouse]

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[Maple Hill Sugarhouse]

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[maplehound]

Some old timers used alot of difrent things to defoam. The guy that sold me my first evaporator asked to taste my syrup one day and was at a lost to tell me what I was using to deafoam. He said that he could ussually taste what people use. Since I used the comecial defoamer he couldn't get a taste of it. He cooked hot dogs, or Ham slices. In his syrup and said that is what he defoamed with. It also took care of supper. He would even cookk foot long hot dogs for school groups that came for tours.
Most defoamers do filter or evaporat off. But they still may leave a different flavor. If it leavesa flavor then it may leave something else behind as well, even if we can't detect it any other way.

[brookledge]

The only thing that has ever been asked of me in reguards to defoamer is to make sure that it is Kosher certified.
Keith

[markcasper]

Thank-you for all of your comments guys! A few things need to be clarified though, as it seems I may not have fully explained the situation.
I am unsure, but I believe this customer had not even opened my syrup yet.
To my understanding, it seemed as if he was calling to see WHAT was used as a defoamer during the production process.

Someone on here seen it as that he DID have an allergic reaction. To my understanding he DID NOT have a reaction, but rather was trying to play it safe by finding out all of the details before consuming any syrup.

Why the gentleman asked about lard is beyond me. It scares me a bit that someone would know that much to be able to ask about lard. I realize that many people will not eat pork or products due to the "uncleanliness". Maybe thats why he asked that, I don't know.

One last question, do any of you guys think I should call this guy back and try to talk to him directly? I talked to him once, but then had to find out exactly what was in the Crisco. On the 2nd call back to him the answering machine picked up and I left a message with my results.

[Russell Lampron]

I would wait for him to contact you. If there is a problem I'm sure you will hear soon enough.

Russ

[Fred Henderson]

Russ is right, don't push the issue.

[mcmp]

If the person is truly allergic to Canola, this is a fair question.

I am allergic to any kind of nuts, born that way. Nuts WILL put me into anaphylactic shock. In my 64 years, I have made it a point to learn what foods have nuts in them and keep up with new foods I buy. I also have learned the covert ways nuts are used in foods. I have to, its my life. A person with a serious Canola Allergic Condition probably does the same, They have to keep up with Canola Based foods/processes.

To learn about Allergic foods, one must understand the process. Its easy to read about the production of Maple Syrup. In so doing, a person would learn that some choose to use Canola for a defoamer. BINGO.....so I ask if Canola was used as a defoamer, nothing wrong with that at all.

My use of defoamer is so small its almost non existant, but when I do need some, I use Commercial Maple Syrup Defoamer nothing else, ever. Under NY State Sugar Law, Lard, Crisco, Butter, Canola etc, 'might' be construed as 'other' ingredient, and if so must be branded and labeled as such ingredient in the syrup.

Paul

[Pete33Vt]

If it was me I would contact him. I would have a hard time not knowing. And like you said he didn't have any reaction. It could bacisly be that he has people that visit his house that are either allergic or have religious belifs. A few minutes on the phone would let me know what I was in for.