Sap Flow up a ladder

[Quabbin Hill Farms]

How fast should sap flow up a sap ladder I put in one this year to help with elevation. I have 4 (6 point) stars in the system, the sap in the ladder which is closest to the pump is racing up the 6 lines the other 3 sets are not flowing well.

Do I have to many sets? I have about 125 taps up stream from the ladder, don't know the rule of thumb for number of taps per ladder I need. I don't have good vacuum at the pump which is a guzzler only about -5 to-7 wondering if the ladder is stealing some I have fixed many leaks in the tubing but don't see a great vacuum change. This system ran about -20 last year I have a valve about 10' from the pump and when i close ti the vacuum climbs to about -17 with no liquid in the pump.

Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks
Greg

[BreezyHill]

Look for leaks after the first ladder. If this is your first ladder system shot for 15 taps per riser. In time you will increase this as you learn how to adjust your system.

for a 1" line you want to have 12 risers to equal the flow of the line, for 3/4 you only need 6.

The faster the rise the better as the sap is clearing the ladder as it should. The others are not moving as fast as they likely are not getting enough vac to lift. You really need 1.2" per foot of rise I find to work really well. It will work at only 1" per foot of rise but not as well.

I run rotory pumps and I inject air as I have plenty of cfms. Guzzlers are limited and injection can short the system else where, but the amount you need to inject isvery very tiny and will only need to be injected to get the furthest to lift. Then the air is reused at the next ladder.

I have a series of 7 ladders on one line to get 112' of elevation change and slope back toward the pump also.

Check for more leaks between #1 & #2 and those after #3 do last as they are putting injected air already.

Ben

[Quabbin Hill Farms]

Thanks Ben how do you inject the air? So you think somewhere between the 3 and fourth rise there is a leak. Where would you normally see leaks? I am using the stars threaded into a fitting is it around those threads it may leak. I have used lots of teflon tape on all these connections. Sorry for all the questions but I am losing production with these low vacuum levls.

Thanks

Greg

[maple flats]

A guzzler is likely not going to do as well as even a dairy pump when using sap ladders.

[BreezyHill]

Greg you are right. You will loose til the leaks are repaired.

For speedy flow up the ladder the sap rides on a bubble of air. I inject thru an 1/8" needle valve installed either at the end of a lateral or in the feeder main to the ladder. I like it close to the ladder so I can check on the ladder easily.

Normal spots are at any connection. Look for speeding sap flow...faster than normal.

Another tell tale is little bubbles coming from a tee connection.

I had an issue with saddles leaking until I switched to bolt lock style. They have a better seal and can be locked tighter if needed.

I don't use tape any longer as it can fail and leak. I like pipe dope if needed. To check if it is leaking use a bottle of sap or water and put some on the threads. If it is sucked away you found a leak. If not then check else where.

Feel free to ask questions.

The dismissing of misconception of things like ladders and dairy pumps only helps producers to grow and produce sap and syrup.

So ask away!

Ben