attaching spouts to drop lines in cold?

[adironmaple]

Due to the addition of 10,000 new taps this year and long term sickness of an employee, we are tapping now trying to finish up before any sap flows. My question is about attaching spouts to dropline when temps are 10-15 degrees. What tricks do some of you TRADERS use to make this simple process go faster and sink the spout on as far as possibly. What are your thoughts on placing the tubing into your mouth to warm the dropline?

[northwoods_forestry]

Warming the dropline with your mouth will likely introduce bacteria right were you don't want it, so not a good idea. You could bring a thermos of hot water with you, but that's cumbersome and with that many taps, probably wouldn't last long enough to be really helpful.

[maple maniac65]

why replace if you are going to introduce bacteria from the get go.

[SeanD]

It sucks to be sure. The cold exacerbates a big part of the problem - the poor design of the one-handed tubing tool. When the tubing tool is closed, the clamp is at an angle to the fitting, so you are not going on straight if you try to do it in one squeeze. I usually start the fitting about to the first barb. Then I move the angle of the fitting in the tool so that it lines up a little better for the second push.

No matter what, after a while it hurts like hell because the handles are so crappy. It's just a thin strip of steel with a thin plastic tube stuffed on the end. They are also too short for the job. Gloves with a sturdy palm will help. After a while your hand is killing you.

Hearing that people make pretty good ones (or at least equivalent ones) at home for very short money, I wish the professionals who make the expensive ones at a hefty profit, spent a bit more time improving the design.

The softer tubing also helps. 30P is hard to use in the cold.

Don't put the tubing in your mouth.

Sean

[NH Maplemaker]

If you are adding 10.000 new drops or Taps this year your a good size operation! So you must have some founds ($$$) kicking around! Try looking into the new Hot End System! There is an article in the new maple news on the front page! Sound like it is just what you need! Check it out at WWW.FLUSHTEC.com or 1-802-2548-8201. That web site may not be right , but the phone # is!! Hope this helps! No I don't own stock in it!! Just happened to read the article !

[NH Maplemaker]

Check out the new Hot End System! Sound like it is just what you need! There number is 1-802-254-8201 for there information! Hope this helps!!

[NH Maplemaker]

Sorry about the double post ,but it said the first one didn't go!

[Maple Hill]

Try the Hot End system I,ve had one for 3 seasons,they work great.

[MapleGroup]

I have heard but haven't tried it, is the liquid you use to seal envelops. You can buy it atyour local dollar store, comes in a 500ml container.

[spud]

Due to the addition of 10,000 new taps this year and long term sickness of an employee, we are tapping now trying to finish up before any sap flows. My question is about attaching spouts to dropline when temps are 10-15 degrees. What tricks do some of you TRADERS use to make this simple process go faster and sink the spout on as far as possibly. What are your thoughts on placing the tubing into your mouth to warm the dropline?

If you go with a smart spout then you don't need to put spouts on drops ahead of time. I use CV2 spouts so all drops can go into your mouth and no bacteria can enter the tap hole. The key is to use a spout that is going to make your life easier and still give you max GPT. The clear smart spout with the ring is what I use for the first two years of the tubings life. It is simple to slip on tubing to a smart spout. On the third year I switch to CV2 spouts in hopes of not allowing any bacteria from the drops to ever enter back into the tap hole. The CV2 spout is the only spout on the market that allows you to put the drop in your mouth with no bacteria issues.

Spud

[Cider Hill Maple Farm]

Adironmaple,

I would definitely invest in the Hot End System, I got one this year and love it, cuts your time in half out in the field. I even set up shop one evening down in my basement making up new drops for a new orchard. 500 new taps and a tees on the drop in no time.

Best,

[Maple Hill]

I have heard but haven't tried it, is the liquid you use to seal envelops. You can buy it atyour local dollar store, comes in a 500ml container.

The liquid is Glycol,you mix it with water. Yes it is food grade and approved for organic systems.

[twitch]

Not sure I would want to do it on 10'000 taps but I always wear rubber faced therma grip gloves and if you give the end of your drop 4 or 5 twists between your thumb and pointer finger on the rubber the friction warms the tube up works good but I wear out a pair of gloves on 500 taps so you will only need 20 pair!

[Maple Hill]

The liquid is Glycol,you mix it with water. Yes it is food grade and approved for organic systems. The liquid is Glycerin not Glycol,Sorry been a long day.

[Super Sapper]

I'm gong to try the disposable hand warmers, they should work well to heat the tubing.

[rhwells2003]

I saw the afternoon temps yesterday were suppose to be mid 20's so I took 4 hours of vacation time and ran home in hopes of getting a jump on the 400 taps I need to put out, before the next deep freeze.

Got home at 1, temp was 24 so headed out with all my drops for my end rings. Those all went on really well. Came back inside at 2:30 grabbed 100 drops and headed to the closest lateral, first one was a little tough, next one a little harder, next one even harder. Think I got 5 out, last one I couldn't completely sink of the last barb on the fitting. Went inside and it had dropped 8 degrees in 2 hours. Amazing the difference 8 degrees makes when installing fittings from mid 20's to mid/upper teens. Night and Day!

Keep looking at the extended forecast for the next warm up. Maybe next weekend

[spud]

Are you using a tubing tool to install your drops onto your lateral lines?

Spud

[Waynehere]

I'm gong to try the disposable hand warmers, they should work well to heat the tubing.

Very interesting.... I have some of those laying around. Let us know how it works out. Might take some along when I FINALLY get out there to tap...:rolleyes:

[rhwells2003]

Are you using a tubing tool to install your drops onto your lateral lines?

Spud

Yeah I'm using a two handed tubing tool

[spud]

When I was putting my drops in my new section of woods it was driving me crazy at times because ice would build up in the groove of the tool. I started bringing a lighter just to melt it so I could keep on going. Is this what you were dealing with?

Spud

[rhwells2003]

No I don't believe its ice or snow build up, I think its a combination of it being cold and using 30p tubing and using a tubing tool I bought that is a homemade tubing tool, it just isn't seeming to work good. I'm having a hard time completely sinking them. I'm not having a hard time with the first barb its the 2nd one it wont finish. when its cold the tubing tool starts slipping and not gripping the tubing good. I'm going to try tightening the tubing tool a little and see if that helps I just don't want to damage the tubing.

Its my first year doing my own thing on my own trees so its a learning experience, the few things that work, the numerous that don't haha

[unc23win]

Does the tool your using have a furrell spreader or whatever its called that you can use to open the tip of the tubing sort of looks like a double sided anvil? You use that first then put the fitting in. I have to use mine once in a while. I think you might be right about needing to tighten the tool. I believe 30P with leader fittings would be one of the more difficult installs because the 30P is a little stiffer and I believe the leader barbs are a little bigger.

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

The Leader clear seasonal or the clear check valves go on easy in the cold with a one handed tubing tool. Love how easy they are to work with and how good they seal in the tap hole.

[wiam]

I have a homemade tool that has not trouble sinking fittings on any day I want to be out. I bought a worn out "factory" one last year and the kids leave the home built home. It is that much better. I think it is your tool. I also think 30p drops is a mistake. When I built my system about 9 years ago all 5/16 was 30p. Over time the stiffer tubing will spin on the T. This causes tiny leaks at each drop. This year we finally got all drops changed to a softer tubing. Much easier to hook to tree also.

[Maple Hill]

I agree with William,use the softer tubing for drops.

[rhwells2003]

Guess I wasn't overly clear. I pre-made all my drops with flex tubing and stubbies. I'm cutting my drops into my 5/16 30p laterals. I haven't had any problem installing my end drops onto my end ring but that's only one barb. But as soon as I go to cutting in a drop with a tee and two barbs into the 30p it really struggles. This Sunday looks like high 30's hopefully I'll get all my drops installed and maybe tapped.

[sapman]

I have this problem too. I've decided it's a combination of issues. Tool is getting old , older tubing has shrunk (especially when it's cold ) , tight laterals, and sometimes ice. I cleaned the tool well recently and make sure it's warm and dry by next morning and it's helping some.

One guy I work with ran a 7/16 thread tap into the grip area and he said it helped.

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

I have a 2 handed Leader tubing tool and it has the fitting on it that flips up to swell both sides of the cut in the lateral line out and the T will go right into the lateral line regardless of how cold it is. It is the cheapest 2 handed tool that is made that I know of but it works great. I wrapped handles with electrical tape really good and it is on about season 10. I have ground it down where it works on both 3/16 and 5/16 and works good even with 30P.