Newbie to the maple scene

[mrrhode04]

Let me start with I have been wondering around this forum for the last week getting an idea of what it takes to make maple syrup. I currently am a beekeeper and would like to get in to syrup also. My uncle has a few sugar maple trees on his property that I will start with this year and then move on to more trees next year. I access to a lot of trees but want to do a small run the first year.

This first year I plan on building a block arch and a flat pan, I will be making the pan at work so it can be what ever size I want it to be. I am planning on having around 30 taps this year. What size pan would work for this year but not be to small for when I decide to add say another 30 to 50 taps next year. I have been doing a lot of research on pans and a lot of people put dividers in to make the syrup gradient, that seems to only be useful if you are going to do a continues flow system. My uncle is retired so he said that he would watch the buckets through out the week and empty them. I will go up to his house Friday and boil over the weekend. What type of pan and size of pan would be best? I was thinking either a 2'x2'x8" or 2'x3'x8". Do I want to but dividers in? Like I said I will be making it at work so I can do anything I want. I have all the equipment to work the sheet metal.

I look forward to this spring, if there is anything else people want to share please feel free. I want to learn as much as possible before the spring.

[optionguru]

I'm sure you'll get lots of thoughts. If you're like most you will want to grow, not sure how much you'll be able to grow if you're only going to boil on weekends. If you have a decent run for a couple of days you'll end up having 100 gallons to boil. Normal rule of thumb is 1 gph per square foot of pan surface area. So a 2x3 pan is going to take you 17 hours to boil. If you're only going to boil one or two days a week I would go with at least a 2x4. I'm on my 3rd or 4th year and I've upsized 3 times.

Welcome and good luck. It's tons of fun and a great experience.

[wishlist]

Although it's important pan size and all that, I would first focus on how you plan on storing sap for 5 days before your able to boil? Treat sap like you would milk, keep it cold and out of the sun.

[Sugarmaker]

Welcome to maple syrup making. Anything that will hold sap and have a fire under it will make syrup. From there the sky is the limit. Reconsider whether you can boil small runs during the week too. 30 ish taps a 2 x 4 flat pan x 8 inches deep would work.
We have a lot we can help you with. Most of us make syrup just a little different, but with the same quality goals in mind.
Regards,
Chris

[psparr]

I can only boil on the weekends also. I tap a little early so my sap keeps longer. I've only had to toss sap a few times. I'd say a 2x4. Boiling is fun, but boiling forever isn't.

[Schiefe4]

This first year I plan on building a block arch and a flat pan, I will be making the pan at work so it can be what ever size I want it to be. I am planning on having around 30 taps this year. What size pan would work for this year but not be to small for when I decide to add say another 30 to 50 taps next year.

How many taps year three? Better question. What's the maximum amount of 12" diameter or greater maples trees that are available to you (your wood lot)?

Also, PM me about your hives. Interested to know more about your setup and how things are going for you in MN.

[VTmaplehobby]

Just to restate everything that has been said already. Plan for expansion to the point you dont think you could possibly get all the work done, because that is where you will end up. At a few taps just boiling on the weekends you will be fine on a 2x3, finishing on a turkey fryer or the like. You can manage 50 in that same pan, but boiling is almost a constant thing, almost becoming a chore. Start prepping a large snowbank that will keep well into spring and invest in some food grade plastice barrels to fill with sap and bury in the snow to keep your sap as cool as possible. It will all work out and you will learn more than you ever wanted to know about this "disease" in an extremely short amount of time.

Welcome and Good Luck!

John

[mrrhode04]

So it is sounding like most people are saying go with a 2x4 pan. Should I go with dividers or not? All of the trees that I can tap are family or family friends. My uncle lives 1.5 hours north of me so to get to his house and boil sap every day is not really possible. I plan on building a big snow bank to put 5 gallon buckets in during the week. If I absolutely have to go get some during the week then I will but every day is not possible. I am not sure how many trees I have available, the persons property that I will start using next your is a long time friend that would love it if I made syrup from his trees.

Is there anything that you guys learned really fast that you wished somebody would have told you when you started?

[BreezyHill]

I would not consider Maple a disease...more like an addiction.

This addiction offers everything that guys live for: Toys, tools, tapping, laying tubing out straight, playing with something sweet, instant approval, and pride in a job well done.

Is it work...not if you love doing it.

If you get paid, then you are a professional at it and you cant get arrested...as in some other professions.:lol:

Just remember that it only lasts for a short amount of time each year and the months and holidays leading up to it, you must take care of the women in your life so that she does not feel slighted or over shadowed by the maple.

When you have infected others with your addiction you know that you are doing things right.

A few years back I was boiling for 2 weeks for 18 hour days. My wife didn't/ doesn't enjoy it like I do; but the sons are starting to see the benefits. My oldest in in college and has worked the angles in his business classes and is behind me 95%. The Middle son is just 18 and loves selling to new accounts and making sugar, while the youngest is very content on filling the fire box and spending time with his girlfriend in the sugar house. Which reminds me... I need to install a video camera to control the room.

While it is painful to dump sap, it is not the end of the world. We have all had to do it. The trick is to control as much as you can in the operation and let the sap flow when it will.

Nobody plans to fail ...they just fail to plan.

The learning is fun, but the eating of the mistakes... that is the best part. Now sharing mistakes with others...makes the best even better.

I think there is a weight lose plan in the future with maple. Seems it is good at getting kids off the coach and into the woods. I have a niece and nephew that want to help on weekends instead of playing video games and movies.:confused:

[psparr]

You can put dividers in. With the amount of sap your going to collect, you'll be batch boiling. (boiling down all the sap you have at one time and finishing it off) But the dividers will help later on when you expand. (you will) They will help establish a gradient and you'll be able to draw off finished syrup as your boiling. Some advice, WATCH THE PAN! Especially if its not perfectly level. Run it dry in any corner and your whole batch is ruined. I was out collecting sap while boiling one time. (One man operation) And noticed this great smell. Kinda like toffee and caramel. Took me a second to get it through my thick head what it was. The feed line to my float box froze, and I spent the rest of the weekend with a wire wheel cleaning the pan. It happens to most. Just try to be the one that it doesn't happen to.

[Super Sapper]

As long as you are making the pans yourself look at doing 2 pans at 2' X 2' with dividers. When you expand you can use them for your syrup pan with the extra one to switch out when the niter builds up. I would have three dividers so you can go in and out on the same side and run your channels crossways instead of the long way.

[mrrhode04]

So you are talking about something like this. Would you still operate it like a batch boil?
10163

[psparr]

Yes, you can batch boil on it. A 2x2 pan filled 2" deep is about 5 gallons of sap. assuming 40 gallons of sap per gallon of syrup, you'd need at least 100 gallons of sap to have 1" of syrup in the pan when your done. That's 2 1/2 gallons of syrup. With a 2x2 pan you'd get around 4 gallon an hour evap rate. That's 25 hrs. boiling!

[Super Sapper]

Yes, like that but you will need another hole in the farthest channel on the same side. Make both pans the same so the plumbing matches up when you get bigger and switch syrup pans for cleaning. Put a valve on both the in and out and use a union between the pans. you can still batch boil with this or play with adding on just one end and watch your gradient form. Making the pans this way will not have any advantage now but will in the future. Keep it fun, you have the option to go very basic or get as complicated as you want and will make great syrup either way. My problem is I figure if I am putting in this much work for X amount of syrup why not make more if you can do it without adding a lot of extra labor such as bigger evap. or tubing over bags or buckets.

[mrrhode04]

Ok so you are saying build two of these pan and join them with a union between the two. So total it would end up being a 2x4 pan, when I decide to go bigger then I would build another pan and move these to the front for syrup pans. I didn't understand the first time, I thinking you were saying use one and then when you get bigger use both. What you said makes sense build these two and use them together.

[psparr]

And if you put a valve between the pans, and don't have enough sap. You could boil water in one and sap in the other.

[mrrhode04]

So this is more what you are talking about. With the quick clamp sanitary fittings I can replace the union with two block off plates to separate the pans. Any other tips or ideas that people have feel free to mention them.

10166

[Super Sapper]

Yes but I would still use valves to isolate as the plates are hard to put in with liquid in the pans. Right now you could use both pans but if you grow and want a 2 x 6 you could just get a 4 foot pan (flue or flat) and use one of the 2 foot pans for your syrup pan. As the season goes you will get niter built up on the bottom of the syrup pan and will need to clean it. You could drain it and replace it with the other one and soak the dirty one. Or you could sell it as it is a standard size for most rigs.

[chad]

where abouts are you going to be cooking, if I was you I would go see how other folks do it to get an idea and then use some of theirs and some of what works for you, but one of the most important pieces of advise I can give you is get a hydrometer actually get two nice to have a spare

[mrrhode04]

Thank you, I will probably add in a valve, that model was more to get an idea of if I was on the right track. I will be cooking in Coon Rapids but the trees are just outside of Mora. I also have family property 15 mile east of Isle.

[chad]

well I am between Mora and Isle I would be happy to stop by and help you out and share some of my knowledge if you would like just PM

[maple flats]

I would suggest you haul the sap home and boil there if at all possible. Do you have a p/u or trailer to haul with? Doing it back home means you could finish on Monday or Tues. if necessary without having the 3 hr. round trip drive.
Just for some perspective, my 1st yr. I started with 29 taps on a 2x3 flat pan (a hobby size). As that seemed real easy, I started adding taps because I seemed to have plenty of time. I eventually got up to 70 taps, then the trees really turned on. I was collecting and boiling every day and when the trees "turned on" I nearly drowned. I got to the point that I was boiling 18-20 hrs a day for 4 days in a row.
If you are only able to boil on weekends, you will be trying to boil 7 days worth of sap in 2 days. When it flows well you will have more to boil than I did doing it daily. If that is your only option, try to find a local producer near your taps who will buy the sap daily (will your uncle haul it?) for the M-W flows and then you boil the Thurs-early Sun. sap. That way you can keep fresher sap and not get drowned in it.