moisture trap

[danno]

Now that I'm well underway getting the vacuum installed, I've got to figure out this moisture trap thing. I've looked at the other threads on this.

Can you use an in-line water filter with a ball? Will the vacuum suck the moisture right through or will the sap run into the filter? I was not going to use the in-line filter becuase I did not want to reduce my vacuum pipe between the pump and releaser, but I just found a filter with a 1 1/2" intake/outake - so it is an easy option again if it will work.

[maplehound]

I uae a water filter all the time for mine. Make sure that the vaccuume side is attached to the center line of the filter and the sap ( releaser) is atttached to the side inlet. I have always use d the 3/4" attachment size and have had no trouble with loss of vaccuume through them. The ball should float up and eventually shut off the vacuume to the releaser. Be sure to have a relief valve for the vacuume to bleed off between the pump and the filter.

[danno]

So let me get this right - you put the vacuum pump on the outlet side of the in-line filter and releaser on the inlet side of the filter? Why that direction, I would have assumed the other way around?

Also, why the relief valve between the pump and the filter? Is that so you can remove the vacuum pressure to unscrew the filter? or is there another reason.

Several have advised me to keep 1 1/2" or even 2" between the pump and releaser to keep up the CFS's. Surprised you don't experience a drop in vacuuum going through a 3/4"?

This looks like a pretty easy/cheap way to handle a moisture trap - any disadvantages with this system?

[maplehound]

You hook it up that way so that when the ball floats up the center is vacuumeing in the ball and seals it off. Then the releaser is put in between to protect the pump from over heating under excess load. You will shut the pump off to unscrew the filter.
I use the regular household filter because they are easy to come by and the short distance that you are resticting it is neglagable and won't effect the end result.

[brookledge]

The relief valve should be between the pump and your moisture trap.
In the event the releaser screws up the ball in the trap will shut off the air and then your regulator will open up. Otherwise without the regulator your vac. pump will overheat and burn up.
Keith

[maplehound]

Thanks Keith
I think that is what I said. Maybe I am not as clear as I could be though.

[NH Maplemaker]

danno, where did you find a water filter with that big of an inlet and outlet :?: Jim L.

[danno]

Can someone recommend a Grainger or Mcmaster part number for a vacuum regulator that goes between the vacuum pump and moisture trap? Although I understand the concept now, I'm not sure what I'm looking for.

Maplemaker - my local plumbing supply store can order 1 1/2" in-line filters. $60. If anyone is intersted, let me know and I will get you their number.

Thanks!

[Maple Hill Sugarhouse]

post edited

[danno]

OK, we're getting there.

Do I need a vacuum regulator or vacuum pressure relief valve - what's the differance? Will either of the pressure relief valves on Maplehill's link work? They don't say the CFM's they are rated for.

[Parker]

I use the 2nd one down on that page,,works on my massport senior (50cfm's),,,dont forget to put a check valve between your pump and releaser

[Maple Hill Sugarhouse]

post edited

[danno]

OK, now I need a check valve as well. Does it matter what kind, or just anything that will keep anything from running from the pump to the releaser?

Does it work better to have the check valve between the pump and moisture trap or between the moisture trap and releaser?

Do I need anything else - so far I've got: pump, check valve, moisture trap, releaser.

[mountainvan]

A vacuum gauge between the pump and the releaser, and the regulator. A couple ferncos to hook stuff together are nice too. Especially if you want to remove the releaser easily for cleaning.

[maplehound]

I have always used the old style milker regulators/ relief valve. I get them from the local dairy dealers for next to nothing. (maybe trade for a little syrup)
I am not understanding the need for the check valve :!: How would oil go against the vacuum and get to the releaser? I think if it did (don't know how it could) the moister trap would get it to. I have never seen oil in my moister trap, but I have seen alot of oil around the exhaust.

[Parker]

If your vacuum pump dies,,or every time you shut it off for that matter, your lines are under vacuum,,depending on the ammount of lines you have hooked to the releaser you talking about a pretty big vacuum resovior,,once the pump is not pulling,,the vacuum in the lines will pull air through your pump,(and nasty oil exhaust pipe),spinning the pump backwards,(surge 76) and the oil from inside your pump and exhaust goes into your releaser and (if the releaser is frozen open) up into your lines

[maplehound]

Parker,
That does make sense. I never thought about that pressure pulling oil out of the pump before. Now that i think of it though it would. I guess when I shut off my vacuum pump I have always turned a valve on the vacuum line to keep the pump from running backward.

[oneoldsap]

Vacuum is the opposite of pressure. Install your check valve between your pump and moisture trap. Letting your pump turn backwards is a NO NO not good for the vanes.

[oneoldsap]

Danno: vacuum and pressure are two different things. Exact opposites in fact. If you check that web site that Maple Hill posted you, you will find what you need. the one with the glass dome is the one we use. It's adjustable to whatever "Hg. you want to pull or your pump is capable of. Just adjust it till you get what you want or all your pump will do which ever comes first. Put a T on your line right out of the pump and screw in your regulator and you're good to go.

[Maple Hill Sugarhouse]

Back to the Moisture

[maplehound]

The moisture traps are also good to have if your tank or releaser fill up and the sap is vaccuumed back into the pump. I had that happen to me one year. My 300 gal vacuume tank filled up over night and the sap was being pulled back into the pump. I had 2 things that saved me. first my pump was at my garage and the tank was in the woods over 300ft away, It also sat about 25 ft higher than the tank. second I had my moister trap( water filter tyoe) in the line. In the morning I just went staight back to the tank an never stopped to check the pump. When I opened the tank the suddenn in flux of air was enough to push the sap up to the moister trap. I think it saved me a pump that time.

[red maples]

So I am going to the store to get things for the vacuum set up.

so let me get this straight.

In this order!!!

pump...vacuum release valve...ball valve...check valve...moisture trap...relaser.

and where can I get a vacuum release valve? and what size do I need I think its the 3/8 one in the grainger catalog 1-15 cfm and 0-30"Hg. Vac is a bb2
and where can I get vacuum pump oil? here in seacoast nh.
will FW webb have this stuff?

if there is anyone who has knowlegde of the surge BB2 and if you don't mind please send me a PM with your phone number or I'll send you mine I'd like to talk to someone about it so I am a little more comfortable!!!

[Haynes Forest Products]

I would do the check valve between the releaser and all other equipment.

[Maplewalnut]

Mine goes.... pump....moisture trap....regulator...check valve...releaser

[red maples]

ok..talked with nh maplemaker this morning and he was a big help...thanks again.

OK got everything except vacuum oil and vacuum /pressure releaser valve. and where do I get a regulator from???

Bascoms has a 1"regulator for $83.00 or something is that the one I want???

[Maplewalnut]

little cheaper....;)

http://www.partsdeptonline.com/cgi-bin/store/commerce.cgi?product=117&cart_id=7760217.20769&exact_match=on/

[red maples]

thanks...getting there