Head Tank Question(s)

[wnybassman]

Getting ready to mount the head tank soon. I am using a food grade 55 gallon barrel, at least for this year. I decided to locate it inside of the shack instead of outside. I have three possible ways to do it inside, but each is varying distances from the evaporator.

Given each would be roughly the same height, would there be any difference in sap pressure at the float box whether the tank is 3 feet or 16 feet away? Will be using 3/4" piping.

[psparr]

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but the only difference in pressure would come from the resistance from the pipe itself. The elbows restrict flow. Other than the change in pressure as the level in the barrel drops. That's probably the biggie.

[BreezyHill]

Correct the difference in flow will be as a result of frictional loss as the distance increases; but if you are a few inches above the float box you will have no problems. Our Tank is located only 12" above the float box when empty. The tank will hold 30" of sap. The distance to the float box from the tank valve is about 20 due to My preheater is on the wall and there is 4 90 elbows in a 1.5" feeder line. Sap comes in at 35 and heats to 190+ in the 8' of steaming. We run around 45 gallons per hour boiling rate on a 2x6.

That is a great pic by your name!

Look at a lot of shacks before you decide on a design. Ask what you would do differently and leave room for expansion.

Good Luck!
Ben

[adk1]

I have the same setup. My tank is set vertical. The bottom of the tank is roughly 12" above the float box and its about a 6' run. I will tell you that if there is less than a quarter tankful of sap, I start to lose enough sap coming into the float and my pans become low. I learned that the hard way last year, luckily no damage occurred. Now I always fill the head tank as soon as it gets to that quarter mark!

[BreezyHill]

I will tell you that if there is less than a quarter tankful of sap, I start to lose enough sap coming into the float and my pans become low.

What size pipe are you running? I have not had that issue yet but when pulling a large batch off, like when first starting in the am the pans get a little low, but I can hit a switch to shut down the air under while pulling so that I don't get a problem. I like to learn from others to save myself grief and work. Thanks!

[adk1]

I have flexible tubing maybe 5/8 or 3/4"?

[BreezyHill]

I use old dairy milk pipeline. Easy to clean and doesn't melt like the old PVC line did. The preheater worked to good back in 2013 and started to warp the pvc and it pulled out of the rubber connection sleeve. Luckily I was right there and only lost 5-10 gallons of sap. Boy that cold sap felt good on my hands after grabbing the hot pvc line. That sure did make a good late night boil turn into a learning situation. Never touch really hot pvc...not pretty burns.

[wnybassman]

That is a great pic by your name!

Look at a lot of shacks before you decide on a design. Ask what you would do differently and leave room for expansion.

Good Luck!
Ben

Thanks, but I guess I already settled on a design. lol

http://mapletrader.com/community/showthread.php?23729-Wnybassman-s-Sugar-House-Project

[DoubleBrookMaple]

IMHO, it could be a significant distance away, and you would not have a noticable difference in pressure and flow. Pascals Law. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pascal's_law
I also have a 55 gal head tank, mounted horizontal, within 2 feet, and 2 feet above float box with just 1/2" pipe.
Works very well, running through a preheater, but, like adk1, it also slows down in flow when head tanks gets down maybe less than 1/4 full, and the pan level drops.
Something to watch!

[BreezyHill]

Two things:
After reading two that are using small diameter pipe and having issues, I am certain you have decided to go with large, at least 1" so there is no risk of burning a pan.

Second until it is built you can always change your mind easily. After it is built it is a little harder to change things. LOL

[SeanD]

IMHO, it could be a significant distance away, and you would not have a noticable difference in pressure and flow. Pascals Law. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pascal's_law
I also have a 55 gal head tank, mounted horizontal, within 2 feet, and 2 feet above float box with just 1/2" pipe.
Works very well, running through a preheater, but, like adk1, it also slows down in flow when head tanks gets down maybe less than 1/4 full, and the pan level drops.
Something to watch!

Last year I used a 55-gallon drum for a head tank. I also laid it on its side inside the sugar house. I threaded a fitting through the buttress fitting in the bung. It worked well, but it never completely emptied at the end of the night, so there would always be a little puddle of sap that collected below the opening. It would have to sit there until the next boil. Do you have the same issue? Are you able to empty the head tank completely at the end of a boil?

Sean

[BreezyHill]

It worked well, but it never completely emptied at the end of the night, so there would always be a little puddle of sap that collected below the opening. It would have to sit there until the next boil. Do you have the same issue? Are you able to empty the head tank completely at the end of a boil?

Sean

This is an easy fix. Go to your local plumbing store, like HD or a small local store and ask them to thread a section of 3/4" pipe to a length that will go thru the 3/4" center hole of the bung cap. On the inside end of this you will thread a 90elbow and a close up nipple that will reach the bottom of the tank. You may need to use pipe dope on the threads to get a perfect seal so as to suck all the sap out.

Ben

[adk1]

This is why I have my tank verticle, no issues with the tank draining. I just drilled my own hole in the bottom of the tank and used a bulkhead fitting. I actually cut off the entire top of the tank for easier cleaning. I am still using the 3/4 inch feed line as my copper apartus that came with the evap to connect into my floatbox actually connects to a 1/2" copper tube. The od of the copper tube fits snugly into the 3/4" or 5/8" flexible fed line which is then pipe clamped on

[SeanD]

That's not a bad idea. I'm going to play with it. The bung fitting is so thin, I might not need extra threading, or maybe I can find a long PVC nipple. Thanks for the tip!

Sean

[wnybassman]

This is why I have my tank verticle, no issues with the tank draining. I just drilled my own hole in the bottom of the tank and used a bulkhead fitting. I actually cut off the entire top of the tank for easier cleaning. I am still using the 3/4 inch feed line as my copper apartus that came with the evap to connect into my floatbox actually connects to a 1/2" copper tube. The od of the copper tube fits snugly into the 3/4" or 5/8" flexible fed line which is then pipe clamped on

I was playing with ideas out in the shack this morning and am now leaning towards a vertical set-up as well. This would put my tank about 2 feet from the float box and the bottom of the tank roughly 14" above the float box intake. If I cut off the top down a bit, I could gain a few inches more height. Cutting the top would certainly make it easier to clean, not to mention installing the bulkhead fitting.

Once I get the stack installed, I'll play with tank location more.

[maple flats]

I have always had my feed tanks outside to help keep them cooler. My current set-up is a 200 gal SS tank about 2' above the float box. The tank sets outside and butted tight against the sugarhouse. I have a 12" x 12' cut-out in the wall, to expose the tank valve. From there I have a 1" copper pipegently sloping in, until adjacent to the float box inlet, then an elbow turns it toward the inlet, another elbow turns it down and finally the elbow to enter the float box inlet. I currently have no pre-heater.
Just inside the sugarhouse there is a T with a fitting in it changing to 3/8" poly. That goes straight up and out just under the roof. That is my level gauge. Just inboard from that T is another T, with 3/4" copper, a gate valve, then a ball valve and into the sink. I adjust flow with the gate valve and then turn flow on and off with the ball valve. This is to test sap or concentrate, and out of season I hold clean water in the tank for cleanup. The feed line is still up about 20" above the float box inlet as it reaches the first ell, so I can supply a pre-heater when I decide to.

[DoubleBrookMaple]

Last year I used a 55-gallon drum for a head tank. I also laid it on its side inside the sugar house. I threaded a fitting through the buttress fitting in the bung. It worked well, but it never completely emptied at the end of the night, so there would always be a little puddle of sap that collected below the opening. It would have to sit there until the next boil. Do you have the same issue? Are you able to empty the head tank completely at the end of a boil?

Sean

I have a 1/2 inch pipe thread tap that I have used for many connections to my 55 gal field drums, and sap cart drum. I put a drain valve on the center bottom of my horizontally mounted head tank. I drain it after each use, and flush with water. At the end of season I used the sani- something... stuff...

9934

[Super Sapper]

I have a 55 gallon tank also set up verticle. I cut the bottom off of it and come out one of the bung holes. Most barrels have a 2 NPT thread bung and a butress bung. You can use the 2 inch NPT and use reducing bushings to reduce down to whatever size you want or there is ususally a 3/4" knock out with 3/4 threads in one of the bungs. Knock out the center with a hammer and screw driver being careful not to damage the threads.