pan choices/sizes/efficiency/preferences

[tcross]

i'll start with some background. this year I had 150 vacuum taps (28") and 90 buckets that I boiled on a 4x4 syrup pan on a homebuilt arch I made with angle iron! I put a warming pan on top of the ribs in the back as a preheater and I added a auf blower and the arch was 98% air tight! I'm planning on getting rid of all the buckets and adding another 150 taps to the vacuum this year and maxing out around 500-550 in a few years! I was able to boil about 25 +/- gph on my current set up! I do not want any more 10-12 hour boils! 5 or 6 would be cool! So I'm planning on stretching my arch another 2' and buying a set of pans that would allow me to boil at a much higher rate! I'd like a reverse flow option, but I guess that's not absolutely needed if the set up is easily taken apart for cleaning! I've been reading around and it seems like each scenario is similar, but different??
So I guess here are my questions!
1) what are the advantages between a raised flue and a drop flue rear pan (does one evaporate quicker then the other?) pros/cons
2)what size ratio should I use for the pans? ie... 4x5 rear and 2x4 front or 4x4 rear and 3x4 front?
3)should I consider making my evaporator and pan set up be a 4x7 instead of 4x6?
4) roughly how much should I expect to pay for such a pan set up?

Thanks a million for any input!!

[motowbrowne]

The main advantages of a raised flue pan are, 1: you won't bang into the flues with firewood when stoking, and 2: you have two float boxes so you can run different levels in each pan. I like to run really shallow (1/2 inch or less) in my flue pan and about 2.5 inches in my syrup pan. You can't do that with a drop flue rig. Evaporation rates should be very similar between the two. Drop flue rigs tend to be a little cheaper, but not much.

Regarding your other questions, I would comment that 4' wide is very wide for an evaporator less than 10' long. Even that's on the short side. The issue is that with such a squat evaporator, you're sending a lot of wasted heat up the stack. I've heard folks on here say they went from a 3x8 to a 3x12 and burned the same amount of wood but made lots more syrup. If I were you if reconsider your plan for a 4x7 and look at something like a 3x10.

As for price, it's a pretty wide range. Check out sunset pans and A&A for less expensive, then Thor, Smokey Lake, CDL, Lapierre, and finally, leader. They're all different and worth a look. I've seen Jim's pans from smokey lake, and they are very, very nice.

Good luck in your search, keep us posted.

[red maples]

to add to motowbrowne

one down side of the raised vs drop is that you do have "2" floats to worry about. but yes you can run the pans at different depths. Although I don't have any issues of hitting the flues... I am carful of that.

and I would have to agree youre better off with a 3 x 10 if you don't plan on a RO or anything like that but if you are making the investment I recommend a hood with preheater and forced air and air tight arch but you will still go thought alot of wood. with an RO you can run 600+ taps easily through a 2x6 and use 2-4 cords of wood vs 15-20 cords of wood without an RO. (I just got my RO for this past season made 90 gallons of syrup on 3 cords of dry feather weight pine) just saying.

SO some other stuff to think about.

[tcross]

an RO is out of the question for the foreseeable future. My sugarhouse set up is just not right for it and won't be for years to come! I have access to plenty of free wood and absolutely do not mind processing it! a tractor and a two way wood splitter works great for processing wood! why would a 3x evaporator waste any more wood then a 4x evaporator? is it because on a 3x I'd need the evaporator longer so the heat has more time to pass under the pans? If a 3x is indeed a much better option I could narrow my set up and make it 8-10' long or so! I have a 4x12 evaporator and syrup pan with drop flue rear pan with a hood, stacks etc and accessories but I feel that would be way overkill for 500 taps (perhaps I'm wrong) and would be a b*tch to fit in the sugarhouse! 12' is a bit too long and 10' would be pushing it! I plan on selling that unit and getting something that I could work with easier! I like the idea of building my own equipment so I do plan on modifying my arch to accommodate a set of pans that I could boil 70-90 or so gph on! I'm not sure what I can get for the unit, but hopefully enough to buy a set of pans that would accommodate my needs!

[motowbrowne]

Sell the 4x12. Build a 3x10 arch. Buy a 3x7 flue pan and either one or two syrup pans depending on if you go cross flow or reverse flow. You nailed it on the reason for the efficiency. My 2x10 will make more syrup on less wood than a 2x6, or a 2x8.

[500592]

If you have a 4x12 just use that it would be effect boil a couple hours then you have more time to be in the woods last year I ran 200 taps on 3x8 and it was great boil a few hours everyday and helped to keep it fresh I would not sell the bigger rig.

[tcross]

thanks for the info/opinions everyone! I'm 90% sure i'll be selling the 12' unit... it's just too big for my shack not to mention it's 25 miles away and would need to be torn down, transported and set back up. and I feel it's way overkill and i'd be doing a lot of waiting for enough sap to make it worth boiling! I have no plans on exceeding 550 taps and if I do, i'll be at the point where I look into a small RO! The max length I could go would be 10'... 8 or 9 would be much better! guess I really need to figure out how many gph i can boil with different pan setups/combinations/styles! guess I could always expand the shack but my wife would like an addition on the house before that happens! Remember, a Happy wife is a happy life!

[jrmaple]

I would recommend looking into a Sunrise Evaporator, the JDL "Extreme" 17" flues, even if you just buy the set of pans from them and make your own arch, they have the option of mirrored finish or dull, plus you could get away with a 2 1/2'x8' evaporator if you had the extreme pans, and save A LOT of wood and space and still get at least 90 gph. And their prices are very reasonable; you could also get a preheater and hood for it if you wanted to achieve more gph and they also have an option of something similar to a steam away which would dramatically improve evaporation.
Here's their website with options and evaporation rates, http://sunriseevaporator.com/jdl-extreme-heat/
Best of luck!

[tcross]

Thank JR! i'll have to inquire about the jdl Extreme! I haven't forgotten about you! I'm hoping, by the end of the next month (at the latest), i'll be able to get up and assess the arch and accessories!

[jrmaple]

No worries or rush, I'll be in school till early June anyways... That's my long term plan, to eventually get a set of Leader Max flue or the JDL extreme pans for a 4x12, easy change over to get more gph without using more wood or space... Best of luck!