Ray Gingrich RO's

[cur dog]

I'm at the point where adding more taps would require an RO or steam away. So far the prices I've seen from the big companies are cost prohibitive. I've heard good things about Ray's units, and hear they are priced reasonably. Is there a list of Rays prices online someplace? A quick search only brought up discussions on his units.

[lastwoodsman]

You can call Ray and he will send you his brochure .
His number is 440-422-3047

[maple flats]

When I bought mine in Sept. of 2011, I paid $3200 for his 250 in gas powered with Hi and Lo pressure switches. At that time his basic 125 gph was $2500, his 250 gph was $3000, his 500 gph was $4500. On top of that a low pressure and hi pressure switch was $100 ea. I'll bet since then the prices have had to rise, but likely not much. Ray is a good man to do business with. If you have electricity at the sugarhouse, I suggest his electric models. I bought a gas and converted it this year to electric since I now have grid power at the sugarhouse.

[Loch Muller]

I just called him a couple weeks ago since I'm thinking the same thing you are and he sent a brochure right out. The prices are $1300 and up depending on what you want. Seemed like a good guy to do business with based on the short conversation I had with him.

[lastwoodsman]

I bought mine last summer from Ray for 2200.00. It is a 125 on a electric 220 motor which I run on a 100 foot number 10 ga extension cord off a Onan 6500 watt home smart generator.

Woodsman9657

[cur dog]

Thanks for the input guys. I'll give him a call. I'm at a point in my little operation, where I have the opportunity to add a bunch more taps. Sitting back trying to decide if the extra syrup justifies the extra expense of adding another 500 taps and an RO unit. Do I have time to do more? Can I retail the additional syrup myself? Will I come home some night to find all of my belongings in the yard?:o

[Dennis H.]

Remember that an RO will allow you to spend more time with the family so why would your stuff end up in the yard?:lol:

[maplefarmer]

Maple flats, I bought the Ray Gingerich 250 ro in 2012, really like it, but the gas engine seems to vibrate so much it is making my wash tank leak, think it may have wore a hole in the bottom on the metal support. need to tear it apart and see. How is switching to electric motor compared to the gas one?

[heus]

Cur dog I paid 4600 for my 375 last summer. He gave me $200 off for paying in full early. Best investment ever.

[maple flats]

Maple flats, I bought the Ray Gingerich 250 ro in 2012, really like it, but the gas engine seems to vibrate so much it is making my wash tank leak, think it may have wore a hole in the bottom on the metal support. need to tear it apart and see. How is switching to electric motor compared to the gas one?
I really like mine better now, it runs much quieter and there are no vibrations. However, in true Ray fashion, his skematic is hand drawn and very hard to follow. I have wired several houses and have rewired many machines following printed skematics, but his is the first that truly confused me. In fact, while I got it running and have the high pressure switch working properly, I still don't have the low pressure functional. I got into the season and could not take the time to study it, since I had lines to check, leaks to fix, sap to haul and everything else that goes on in and around the sugarhouse during the season. All season, I had to manually shut the RO off when I heard the pump sound indicate I was out of sap. That will be corrected as soon as I finish my season, which will likely come after this coming weekend. I bought the motor Ray told me to, and got the rest from Ray. The motor, delivered was $350 and the rest cost $187.00, plus the wiring in the sugarhouse and cord for the RO. All totaled cost almost $600. Money well spent, and the Honda motor I took off is set up for a spare for my 2 gas powered vacuum pumps, which I needed early in the season.

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

Does anyone have anything negative to say about Ray Gingrich ROs? Seems like all I have heard is positive and about 40 to 50 percent the cost of commercial units by the Maple companies.

[jmayerl]

My seal between the high pressure pump and motor began leaking a few drop of oil per hour. Ray said run it until season is over as long as it doesn't get worse.

[Jshmohr]

We got Ray's bigger 125 gph unit and love it! We have spent way less time cooking this year, the thing works great!

[heus]

One negative thing about my 375 is that it doesn't take out the garbage or stack firewood.:lol:

[concord maple]

We got Ray's bigger 125 gph unit and love it! We have spent way less time cooking this year, the thing works great!

I take it he sells one smaller than the 125 gph unit? Are they simple to operate? Basically all you need are permeate and concentrate catch tanks and you would be ready to go?

[jmayerl]

Does anyone have anything negative to say about Ray Gingrich ROs? Seems like all I have heard is positive and about 40 to 50 percent the cost of commercial units by the Maple companies.
Now that all my tanks are full and the RO won't turn on and no answer at either of his numbers when I called at 4 I would say I'm kinda mad! No skematics for trying to trouble shoot it either. This sucks!

[pierre]

i bought his 250 elect. and its been a life saver i made over 120 gal. of syrup this yr. the most i ever made and i was able to see my wife this season to and get some sleep .

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

Now that all my tanks are full and the RO won't turn on and no answer at either of his numbers when I called at 4 I would say I'm kinda mad! No skematics for trying to trouble shoot it either. This sucks!

You get in touch with Ray or did it take couple days?

[jmayerl]

You get in touch with Ray or did it take couple days?

Disclaimer: I am a complete idiot sometimes and just need to walk away and start over.

After taking electrical box apart which was very simple. I troubleshot through the few relays and everything seemed it working properly. I then looked again at the motor and the cut out safety switch apparently I just didn't push it in all the way trying to reset it. I assume it popped up because I was having problems priming the pump which is why I added a feed motor. Ray did call me back late in the evening I didn't answer because I was busy concentrating and boiling and said I could call him back anytime the next morning.

[Bucket Head]

"Disclaimer: I am a complete idiot sometimes". Lol!

Here's another disclaimer: Me too. I think we've all been there a time or two.

Glad to hear that it was a simple fix. Simple fixes are awesome.

Steve

[Clarkfield Farms]

Teaching a nephew about fixing his Jeep (suffered from the legendary "Jeep Death Wobble Syndrome," lol!): "With things that are difficult or impossible to accurately pinpoint at the beginning, always start with the simplest, easiest, and cheapest solution first. You can always work up from there." Always good advice. :D

[ldick]

Check out this for fixing jeep steering problems.

http://youtu.be/fqOZMibSTfo

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

Is anyone on the trader running a 500 Model Deer Run RO by Ray?

[jwalker91]

To go along with Brandons post is anyone on here running a 250 gph from ray I'm looking to get one next season to go with my 2x6 any input would be much appreciated

Thanks josh

[heus]

Search old posts. There are several with the 250 model on here. None with the 500 that I know of. I have the 375 model which is expandable to 500 adding a 4th Membrane. Ray now makes a single membrane 500 but I don't know of anyone that has one.

[maple flats]

Ray also makes a 75 now too. As I understand it, Ray makes a 75-125-250-375-500 and 1000 GPH sizes, in gas,diesel (larger sizes only) or electric. I have his 250, and ran it for 3 seasons. When I add enough taps to force me to get a bigger one, I'm seriously thinking his new 500 with 1 8x40 membrane, in electric.
I recently heard a story about Leader. It seems they tried to get Ray to sign with then to build units only for them. Ray asked how they would price them, he told them he would not consider their offer without a written price structure, compared to what he sold them to Leader for. They finally admitted they would double whatever price they paid. Ray then said he will keep doing RO's the way he has, he would not do that to his customers.
While Ray is not ant likely never will be on the internet (Amish), his units are carried by a few others. Our sponsor (The Maple Guys), Sunrise and likely others carry his RO's.
While Ray does not have a web pressence, he does have 2 phones, his shop and his sugarhouse. He has no secretary. Just call his shop, if he is not there just leave a message. He does return all calls (However when in the midst of maple season, the sugarhouse number works best but at times that doesn't get answered either. I have never waited more than a day to get a return call, and usually much sooner.
When I needed a new feed pump because the housing cracked in the season, he got one to me in much faster time by regular UPS than Northern Equipment showed with a $71.00 upgrade on shipping. Besides, Ray's price was lower even though he buys those pumps thru Northern.
Regarding Pre-filters, I've searched the web for even lower prices, Ray beats them all.

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

I have talked to quite a few members on here and other users that have the 250 and 375 units and everyone have been happy. I am likely going to order a 500 unit tomorrow as I like simplicity of the one membrane and room to expand. The problem that Dave(maple flats) had with low pressure pump failing Ray figured out what caused it on a few of the units and put a check valve in to solve it. The membrane on the 500 unit apparently needed to be run at a higher pressure and he has made changes on the units he is now manufacturing to run it at 400 psi as it was not doing what he thought it was. He is constantly making changes to make the ROs better without hardly any price change. I have done a lot of research and it came down to CDL and Ray and he is about 40 to 45% the price of CDL and his units are simple enough I can probably work on about everything on it. I know it doesn't have all the bells and whistles but if it is taking out 300 to 325 gallon of permeate per hour, I have a steamaway with tons of hot water for washing, so I can do without a couple of bells and whistles.

[heus]

Brandon what's the price on the 500 single membrane?

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

$ 5195 Electric

[heus]

That's a good price. My 375 was 4700.

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

375 is $ 4795 now.

[jimbison]

looking at Ray's RO also have not decided on the 375 or 500 running 1600 taps expanding to 2000 so probably the 500 anyone know if this can be gas powered or expandable thanks jim

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

$4995 for gas for a 500 model. Call Ray and he will let you know.

[jimbison]

thanks for the info just waiting to sell the barrels then will order now to just fill the woodshed again

[jwalker91]

Just sent out the check this morning for one of rays 250gph electric unit going to go out Sept 20 and pick it up and stay for the consignment auction ray has and see if I can pick up some more stuff for the addiction. Also talked to ray about a steam hood he mentioned a fella in pa who builds steam hoods very reasonably maybe 300-400$ for a 2x6 has anyone heard of this guy or done business with him thanks for any info

[bix]

a an a metal Ulysses pa great guy I have a 2by8 and works great I to have to go out in October and pick up my 250 ro

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

David Beechy is in Myersdale, PA and is very reasonable. He is Amish so about 30% of what evapoator companies charge. I have one his cousin built and now they work together some. His phone # (814) 662-2304. He is close to Henry Brennaman.

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

I am supposed to go up next Saturday and pick up my 500 electric unit. Was going saturday before Memorial day and he asked me not to as they were going out of town at last minute. Then, day before he called back and told me to come. I had already made plans to go out of town to visit family.

[jwalker91]

bix what did he charge you for your steam hood if you dont mind me asking.

[bix]

Jwalker I do not know for sure I think 200 that was 2009 call me some time 570 529 3350 after 3pm

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

Made round trip yesterday up to Deer Run to pick up 500 RO. Ray is a great guy and very helpful. Was 800 mile round trip so little long but beautiful day for a drive. Picked up 2 of the 275 FDA good grade approved cage tanks. Very happy with quality of RO. Ray has a show place and it is in immaculate condition and everything is top notch condition. Not what I am used to seeing at the Amish in other areas. Landscaping, flowers and building were so nice and everything spic and span.

[maple flats]

Brandon, You'll be equally impressed when you start using the new RO. Congratulations!
Dave

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

Thanks Dave. Mine has a fiberglass vessel on it vs stainless. He also changed to running pressure on the 500 units to around 395 psi with 600 psi stainless hoses and few other changes. I think it will probably do 10 to 12 percent with a single pass without any problem. I expect most days I will run 630 gallons of sap through it so it won't run that long. Long enough to get me plenty of permeate to flush with.

I did have him to install me a thermometer port and thermometer in the wash tank so I know what wash temperature is at all times. I am very happy with the quality of it at this time and it the electrical on it is very simple so I should be able to work it it myself.

[maple flats]

I've run up to 2000 gal thru my 250. When I run a large qty, I lower the pressure and make 2 passes. Normally, on regular days I run at 275-280 psi and remove 75% in one pass, then I recirculate at about 225-240 PSI and remove another 50% or so. On high sap days I run at about 225 PSI and remove less per gal but end up removing more in an hour because that increases my flow from about 250 gph to over 300 sometimes even 350 gph. Then I make a second pass. It just seems to reduce large amounts a little faster. Once I have 7-8% concentrate I'm boiling, while I continue to remove more with the RO. You will love it.
I'm seriously thinking of upgrading in a year or 2 to a 500. The improvements Ray is using sound real good.

[schellmaple]

I have a question about one of Ray's 125 units. I used this unit last year and for an amateur I had very little problems. I did over pressure the vessel and blew the cap off the end. No problem put it back on and it worked fine. I did notice when I was installing the cap that one of the small o rings had a small nick in it. Called Ray and he sent it right out. I replaced the o ring the other day and went to do a rinse and now I can't get my pressure above 220 psi. This is with the pressure valve completely closed. Is this because I am just running water in it or do I have a bigger problem??? I did check all the seals and o rings and everything looks fine. I put a call into Ray and I'm sure he will return my call. Just wondering if anybody had any ideas.

Thanks Brian

[mountain man maple]

I ran into this last year with a coster ro I bought same design as rays machines. With water on test run would only get about 300 psi the coster was designed to run at 500 psi. When I put sap to it no problem building higher pressure.

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

Doubt you will get over that pressure from what Ray said with running just water through it.

[maple flats]

Check to be sure you installed the seal correctly. Each has a u shape and the open U should face the membrane to form the seal. When pressure is present, it fills the inside of the U and forces it against the top or bottom of the membrane, and against the inside of the vessel.

[schellmaple]

I called Ray on another question and he said to make sure the cup seal was on the top of the membrane and that the cup is facing down because that is were the pressure is coming from. When Ray installed it he had it on the bottom and it filled above the seal with rancid sap.

[schellmaple]

What % is everybody getting out of their RO before sending it to the evaporator? Just want to see what % everybody else is running the Deer Run Maple RO at.

[MISugarDaddy]

Last year was our first year with our Deer Run 250 and on one pass, without any recirculation of concentrated sap, we went from 2.0% to 7.5%. By opening the recirculation valve open less than a quarter turn we were always over 8.0%. A neighbor bought a CDL Hobby unit, paid close to $5,000 for it and was so mad he hadn't gone with one of Ray's units. He stopped over a couple of times to check out how well my unit performed and how simple it was to operate and maintain. Outstanding machine!
Gary

[maple flats]

In one pass I go from 2% to 8% (recirculation valve open slightly) and I discharge it to my head tank. Then I have a suction line in the head tank that connects back to my raw sap infeed line. I have a ball valve on each source and to concentrate further I just close one valve as I open the other and then if pulling from the head tank, I back off on the pressure or my pressure will climb over my high limit setting. I run at 275-280 PSI with raw sap and down to 225-250 to reconcentrate. I reconcentrate to a max of about 14%, or until my 200 gal head tank gets low, then I switch the valves back and draw from raw sap. Then I turn the pressure back to the 275-280 psi. To change in either direction takes less than 15 seconds and the RO is never shut off to do it. With my 250 I run about 240-260 GPH on raw sap and down to about 180-200 GPH on recirculate.
If my head tank needs more fast I lower the pressure setting and then I get lower concentration but more GPH. I never do this for more than maybe 15 minutes and I don't remember my flow readings when I did it, but that brings the head tank level up a little faster. In use I generally run my evaporator to match the RO output most of the time, maybe 80-90% of max. When I get a 500 RO I plan to fire the arch to it's max and run more at higher % concentrate.

[Mark-NH]

Last year was our first year with our Deer Run 250 and on one pass, without any recirculation of concentrated sap, we went from 2.0% to 7.5%. By opening the recirculation valve open less than a quarter turn we were always over 8.0%. A neighbor bought a CDL Hobby unit, paid close to $5,000 for it and was so mad he hadn't gone with one of Ray's units. He stopped over a couple of times to check out how well my unit performed and how simple it was to operate and maintain. Outstanding machine!
Gary

Those are some exciting numbers. Setting up our new Ray 250 RO right now. Bring on the sap

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

Ran least couple hundred gallons of water through the RO this afternoon and everything seemed to work good and I think the plumbing and setup is going to work good.

[markct]

Has ray stepped up his game and made a food appropriote ro yet? I believe his early ones used a pressure washer type pump and had many brass fittings etc generaly things the maple industry is moving away from

[tuckermtn]

curious no one has chimed in on this. my first RO had a Magikist high pressure piston pump (used in car washes still) with all kinds of brass fittings, etc. yet it was made in 1982. lots of brass pressure fittings as well, and i think my newer RO (2009) still has brass fittings on it i think?

industry norms seem to always be a moving target...

[markct]

I agree that its an ever evolving thing, and yes most early ro did have those type pumps, and also most sap tanks were galvanized and lead soldered as were the evaporator pans, but times change and now you wont find a manufacturer using either of these materials. I think ro for the most part have evolved too as the fda has started breathing down our necks, my cdl 250 had a brass procon pump originaly, when it wore out I replaced it with stainless same as the cdl machines made a year or two later have. And nowdays you can buy stainless fittings as cheap as brass, sometimes cheaper even.

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

Ran 400ish gallon of water thru RO before running sap thru it. When I ran the sap thru it, I never could get permeate flow as high as the concentrate flow even running it over 375 PSI which my unit is designed to run at 395. First pass sugar went int at 1.7 and came out at 2.8 according to refractometer. Re circulation valve/bottom valve was completely closed and high pressure top valve only opened about 1/8 turn. Maybe some of you guys can tell me what I w as doing wrong.

[schellmaple]

I know on my 125 gallon per hour unit Ray said I should double your intake. Sap coming in at 2% out at 4%. I have seldom seen this with the recirculate valve closed. Maybe someone else will comment on what we are doing wrong.

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

Here is a post I posted on here earlier on different topic:

I did talk to Ray this am and my RO is different than the 125, 250 and 375 units which is about what everyone on here that has Deer Run RO's are running. On my paticular model, it is designed to run at 350 PSI and the bypass/recirulation valve has to be opened about 1/4 of a turn. The smaller units, that isn't neccessary but it is on my. Of course, nothing in his instructions that say anything about this. I took 825 gallons of sap down to 130 gallons of concentrate in about 2.25 hours and no sugar passage. That is somewhere around 11 to 12 percent as I didn't test the final concentrate. I have been in discussion with him about a nice instruction manual complete with pictures and diagrams. Also, may do a video or maybe one for each model and post them so others can view them. It will be sometime later in the year before this happens but this way manuals can be emailed to someone along with a brochure, prices, etc. Instructional videos will be a big plus to the user also if we can do those.

[PACMAN]

I am interested in purchasing one of rays units. Whats the largest RO he makes

[jimbison]

I believe he now makes a 1000gph I just bought the 500 this spring from him if you need to look at one I am only about a half hour away from you

[maple flats]

Last I heard Ray's largest is a 1000 GPH. Since going with a higher pressure 500 with an 8" membrane, he may offer the 1000 as 2 x 8" or 8 x 4". He has had the 8 x 4" for a few years.

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

1,000 gallon is 2 of 8" membranes.

[wiam]

Comparing membrane surface area 1-8" is equal to just under 5-4"

[PACMAN]

Now how much is the 1000 and do ya think it could be exspanded?

[maple flats]

PACMAN, How many taps are you planning for? I ran 1200 last year of my own and bought from about 400 more, all on a 250. I do admit it was a lot for a 250, but even on my busiest days I never ran the RO more than 5 or 6 hours. Unless you will have well over 2000-2500 taps I would not go that big. The original RO Ray offered as a 1000 GPH unit was not expandable. He originally offered a 125 expandable to 250, a 375 expandable to 500 and a 750 that would go to a 1000. I understand he has a new generation that uses 8" membranes (his original were all 4"). WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER has one. It goes to a higher pressure (The originals maxed at 300 PSI) and can do better than 2% to 8% in one pass.
If you want to know the price, just call Ray at 440-422-3047. It seems someone on here announced that Ray is not able to make more in time for this season, but if that's the case, Ray can verify. If you get his answering machine, leave your name and number, he will call you back. He works long hours, but his only phone is in his shop and don't call on Sunday or you will only get his voicemail.

[PACMAN]

Thanks Flats. I want the 1000 because I am planning on 6000 taps or maybe a little over. Do you think the 1000 would be enough?

[OneLegJohn]

Ray said he can't take anymore orders before the season. He said he could have sold about 35 more but had to start tapping trees. Also, there is quite a list of people waiting for used units.

[doocat]

I would think about the 1000 gph long and hard before purchase with that many taps. We run a 3x8 with 3500 taps and have 1000 now. We are looking to go with a three post unit for next year due to adding taps. There will be a lot of long days if your are only single passing with a 1000 and recirculating will take up precious time waiting. With the three post you can take it to 15 + in one pass and spend the day making syrup, not waiting.

Just my 2 cents, Craig

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

Craig what are you getting on first pass with the 1,000 unit? I went from about 1.7 to 6 second time I used my 500 but last time sap was 32 degrees and I could only get it to double the sugar and I am assuming because the sap was 32 degrees, it didn't want to go through membrane.

[PACMAN]

Craig,Is the 1000 capable of handling 6000 taps? And do you mean the 1000 can have another post added to it. If you dont mind me asking,how much was the 1000?

[PACMAN]

Just got off the phone with Ray and he said the 1000 would be fine for 6000 taps. He told me one pass would bring 2% sap to 12 Brix. The 1000 has a 20 horse Honda and is $10,000. He also told me he makes a 2000 and a 3000 gal, an hour unit also.

[PATheron]

Do any of you guys understand how these machines recirculate effectively? It seems like to recirculate you crack open the valve and it does seem to help your flow rates like its keeping the end of the membrane clean. What I don't understand is how that can be because Im guessing the high pressure pump probly flows 15 gpm or maybe 20 at most and ive always understood it took around 70 gpm across the membrane to provide enough flow to keep it clean. What am I missing? Theron

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

If you don't need gas, I think he makes it in electric too. Use a lot of gas and have to vent the exhaust unless you don't have enough electric service. I would guess it would probably be around 30 to 35 amps max and the electric may be cheaper than gas as that size honda engine is expensive.

[mellondome]

Do any of you guys understand how these machines recirculate effectively? It seems like to recirculate you crack open the valve and it does seem to help your flow rates like its keeping the end of the membrane clean. What I don't understand is how that can be because Im guessing the high pressure pump probly flows 15 gpm or maybe 20 at most and ive always understood it took around 70 gpm across the membrane to provide enough flow to keep it clean. What am I missing? Theron

That is how they are set up... wonder what the true numbers and % are.
Getting ready to hook up your old r/o ..

[PACMAN]

No power where I am.I have to have gas. He said it would take a 15000 watt gen to run the electric.Just cheeper to get the gas engine,a generator would burn just as much fuel. Plus you have to purchase the generator and the ro, not cost efective.I think Ray told me the pump for the RO does 28 gal a min. And a 8 inch post. I didnt ask him if there was more than one.

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

1,000 gph has 2 of 8" fiberglass 600psi vessels with xle-440 membranes.

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

That is how they are set up... wonder what the true numbers and % are.
Getting ready to hook up your old r/o ..

With sap that was about 45 degrees, I was getting 6 peremeate and 2 concentrate. With sap that was 32 degrees, I was getting about 4.5 permeate and 4 concentrate.

[PATheron]

Brandon- Those are great numbers, good as any commercial machine. Your 45 degree is 480 an hour which is almost 500 and your second set is 510 per hour which is over the rating of your machine with cold sap. Im just trying to figure out how the recirc works so well. On a commercial machine if you turn off the recirc the numbers fade right off. Maybe the high pressure pump is just a super high flow pump or something. Seems like I saw one on of the units and it was a general pump and it was pretty high flow. On the old ro machines the recirc pump is 70 gpm and on modern machines I think its close to that number too with the submersible pumps they use. Theron

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

Pump on it is 3000 psi pump. Wish I could get better concentrate flow with 32 degree sap, but I guess that is normal??

[maple flats]

Brandon, try minor adjustments to your recirculation valve. Looking at your flow rates at 45 and 32 I think that valve might not have been open the same amount. If it was experience says that warmer sap gives greater total flow than colder sap, yours is the other way around. If the recirculate valve was in the same exact position, the difference may just be in exact reading of the flow meters. At any rate, try tweaking the adjustments slightly, at some point you should be able to get a higher removal rate. Even though my unit and yours are different generations of Ray's RO's, I still think you can find a setting to give higher permeate removal at colder temps. My RO is simple to tweak the settings, I just adjust the recirculation valve and the pressure on the gauge until I find the sweet spot. After a little experience it becomes simple to achieve the max. setting. In that respect your unit should be similar to mine, just with higher pressures. Just because Ray said to have the recirculate valve open 1/4, does not mean it must be exact, experiment to attain the best readings. As temperatures change the settings may need to be tweaked again.

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

Dave,

I played with it a bunch both of the last 2 times I ran it. Ray didn't say how much to open it, I just kept playing to try to get the max through it. Going to do a soap wash before or after the next run as it may be getting plugged some. I was talking to Ray and he said that was normal with 32 degree sap as he said it was hard to get it through a membrane. Didn't measure the temp of the sap but all the tanks had ice in them and temp outside with windchill was 0 and below freezing inside where sap was held in sugarhouse. Everything was freezing up on me trying to haul it in, so it was cold, cold.

[PACMAN]

Im going to get the 1000 gal an hour unit from Ray. My question is, how many taps could someone have on vacuum with a 2 by 8 with a preheater? Say I plan on boiling 16 hrs a day. Whats the max? This is for next year.

[PATheron]

Brandon- Cant you adjust your concentrate to any number you want? Like when the sap was cold can you still just adjust your concentrate to two gallons per minute or doesn't It work that way? Theron

[mellondome]

Im going to get the 1000 gal an hour unit from Ray. My question is, how many taps could someone have on vacuum with a 2 by 8 with a preheater? Say I plan on boiling 16 hrs a day. Whats the max? This is for next year.

Easy to calculate...how many gph does your evaporator average. Then figure out how many gph permeate the r/o will remove. How many hours you want the ro to run and how many hours you want to boil. That will give you total gallons you can process in your time allotted. Divide by your average sap flow per tap... now you have a tap count to go off from. Make sure you remember time for startup and shutdown.

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

Theron yes I can adjust it back. Only used it 3 times so still getting hang of it. Don't work exactly same as commercial units but similar.

[PATheron]

Youll get the hang of it but itll take a while to really learn it in and out. I have no idea how the recirc works really but your getting really good numbers. Even with the perm down your doing the rating of the machine with ice in the sap that's pretty great. Whatever you do filter the crap out of the sap, rinse all the perm through it you can afford to keep and when you do clean it try to rinse it some before you even make the wash water. That will give you a way better wash. Just a for instance I try to have a 1500 gallon plastic tank for every two eight inch post and the way I do it is every time I run the machine I run that much perm back through it. Its probly wrong but what I do now is if the sap is going to run tomarrow I just rinse the machines with all the perm, if its going to freeze tomarrow I put them on soap wash. So I don't wash them every day. One big advantage I have though that probly lets me get away with this is I have the expensive lapierre sap filters on every two posts too so I really filter it like crazy. Ill run my machines with a clean filter then change it when I rinse them so Im always changing out the filters. Theron

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

I am washing and rinsing mine every day. Normally it isn't going to run over 2 hours per day, maybe 3 max. I may go to soap washing it about every day too to keep membrane nice and clean and flow high. It doesn't have a recirc pump, but has a recirc/bypass valve that lets you recirc the concentrate back through again to get desired output of concentrate.

[jmayerl]

Anyone with a electric 250 know what the amp draw is, just got mine after upgrading from the hobby 125 and I really don't want to call and bother for a quick question like that but also want to know if I need to upgrade my 220 outlet

[schellmaple]

I have the 125 unit which has the same motor. I have a 20 amp double pole breaker.

[maple flats]

It's a 230V 9.5A single phase motor. You do want a 20A double pole breaker to handle start up surge.

[jrthe3]

I have a buddy that asked me about a small ro i had rays in mind has anyone in pa had any problems with the new inspections with rays ro not using food grade conponants i know inspector would not let my pvc piping in my sugar house pass cause pvc is not food grade when i looked at rays ro the pumps didn't look food grade

[markct]

Depends on the PVC pipe, there is stuff that's for drains and then theres stuff that meets nsf61 for potable water. I would have to assume you used the other type or the inspector didn't look at the markings on it.

[highvac]

Depends on the PVC pipe, there is stuff that's for drains and then theres stuff that meets nsf61 for potable water. I would have to assume you used the other type or the inspector didn't look at the markings on it.

Lets be clear here. NSF61 is not a food grade standard. It is for potable water only. There is a big difference.

[bix]

Hey Dave,

I talked with you last May regarding a 250 RO made by Ray.

I did not make it up to your place, but am wondering if I could call you and pick your brain about the RO? I picked mine up in October.

Please let me know, thank you. Ray

[markct]

Lets be clear here. NSF61 is not a food grade standard. It is for potable water only. There is a big difference.
Yes your correct i mis spoke i meant potable water approved which is generaly accepted for sap handling.

[jrthe3]

the inspector told me it had to be cpvc pex stainless or copper and he siad pex or stainless would be best choice cause standards are heading that way he was not real impressed with the pumps on my ro mainly the feed pump witch is a well pump but it cast iron he said he like to see stainless but he let it go i just could guess how they like that pressure washer pump

by no means am i trying to degrade ray and his equipment he ia a great guy and make great systems

[wiam]

I think there are many places that the big maple manufacturers could move toward food grade.

[Clinkis]

I'm rather confused why if it's safe for potable water then why it's not safe for RO plumbing? My familly and I consume a lot more water then we do maple syrup. I'm all for keeping things as safe as possible but sometimes I wonder about the reasoning behind some rules and regulations

[Mark-NH]

I could live my entire life not dealing with that inspector and be very happy.

[lastwoodsman]

I know on my 125 gallon per hour unit Ray said I should double your intake. Sap coming in at 2% out at 4%. I have seldom seen this with the recirculate valve closed. Maybe someone else will comment on what we are doing wrong.

On my 125 with the recirculation valve closed on 2% I was getting 3.4 this year. Opening the recirculation valve a turn gave me 6.5/7%
Had to put on a new pressure gauge this year. Mine worked fine but would not drop below 180 when I turned off the machine. Could not get it to recalibrate.