3/16 Tubing

[farmerfletch]

Hi all, I heard about this idea of running 3/16 line instead of 5/16, and i thought it might be worth a try on a new section of the sugarbush. I was wondering if anybody has any experience with this stuff and if anybody could tell me how much the 3/16 line costs and how to set up the lines. Any feedback is appreciated.


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[Machinist67]

Buy the tubing from D&G. I think I paid $42 per 500FT. I bought my fittings from Value plastic in CO. Look for the report from Tim Wilmot. Also Gary R has alot of knowledge. Do a search on here, there are many threads to read.

[mvh1969]

I bought 10 rolls last week at the VT farm show @ $38 per roll from D&G. I bought my fittings from McMaster Carr (part numbers in Tim's reports), except for the gauge adapters I got from US Plastics & the gauges came from FW Webb.


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[maplehillbros7179]

Does anyone know if it works well that's pretty cheap.

[BlueberryHill]

I set up the D&G 3/16 tubing with McMaster fittings this weekend. approx 20' drop from lowest tap to collection drum. 1st line with 14 taps showed 17 lbs of vacuum at the top and that was 15 mins after we set it up and all f the trees were not running and there was still lots of air in the line. The 2nd line has same elevation and has 18 taps but a couple were leaky at the top and I don't think we fixed them good so I'll work on that soon cause there was only 7-8lbs of vac at the top of that line. So I think YES, it works. Can't wait to see what we get once it is tuned up and we have a good run.

[steve J]

I to bought mine 3/16 from DG they are only one that has it and the fittings from McMaster I set it up last September but if it runs as they say it will perform at a level equal to vaccum .I have 5 lines all with more than 30 ft of drop.

[BlueberryHill]

Sorry for the hourly updates, haha. But right now my first line as pulling 25 pounds! So yeah, it works! The other line is still just at 8-9 so we have leaks to attend to on that one. Overall length, taps, and height are very very similar on the 2 lines so the overall performance should be nearly equal.

[steve J]

Bluewberry your going to have exactly the same problem I expect to have! Way to much sap and not enough evaporator to boil it but what a great excuse to get Bill Mason to make us larger evaporators lol. Good luck I can't wait to tap but I must get thru Valentine's Day first Since the Florist business of mine pays for my maple fun.

[BlueberryHill]

Valentines day will be gone before you know it man. Looks like it'll be too cold for much sap until after then anyway so that works out for you. I have a back up plan in place now if I do end up with too much sap so that is good (thanks Chris) but I am still hoping to get my arch extended before things really get flowing. I'm trying to resist spending thousands on an evaporator right now. Gotta at least have a building up to put it in! We'll see if I can get this homemade extension done cheaply this year.

[farmerfletch]

One more question about the layout of the 3/16 line, do they have to be over 150' long? because on Wilmot's report all of the lines were 150-700' long


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[Tor Haxson]

Long lengths are not required.

What matters most is the elevation drop from the last tap.

I ran some 3/16 this year and when I went to add trees at the top of the run yesterday you could feel the vacuum as the sap in the tubing below pulled the sap from above down the hill.

3/16 is a lot of fun, it fills quicker so the sap moves faster so even if the yield is not increased it makes the run seem more active and fun to watch.

I do think the natural vacuum it gives will help.

--
Tor

[Machinist67]

Also long as you have the tap count needed and the elevation drop of over 33FT it does not matter what length it is.

[farmerfletch]

I'd need 4-10 taps right? And in Wilmot's report he mentions using a 1/4x3/16 coupler, would using a smaller fitting in the 5/16 line create a problem?


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[Machinist67]

I have 20-30 taps per line because I want my sap column to stay full for a longer period. I bought 5/16X3/16 couplers. Tim had runs with as many as 22taps.

[farmerfletch]

How long are the lines that your putting 30 taps on?


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[Machinist67]

My rlines are 250-300ft long

[farmerfletch]

And you don't have any issues with the 3/16 being to small for all the sap?


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[Machinist67]

We have seen 20-30gal per tap with these runs. I am shooting for 30gal per tap on all lines. you really have to have the right fall in the bush for it to work properly.

[farmerfletch]

You want a pretty steep drop from the last tap to the mainline right?


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[Machinist67]

The best layout would be if you could, to have atleast 33ft of fall after the last tap. If you have more it does not hurt but it does not raise your vacuum any higher. Some guys have had 33gal per tap.

[farmerfletch]

So ideally I'd want 33' vertically down from my last tap?


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[Machinist67]

If you have column full of liquid 33ft high and have a vacuum gauge on the top of it and open the bottom your gauge would read perfect vacuum for your elevation, so yes the best you can do is to have atleast 33ft of fall from the last tap. Theoretically you will then have perfect vacuum at each tap as long as you do not have any leaks.

[farmerfletch]

Ok, thank you for answering my questions, I think I'll order a roll of line and see how it goes.


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[Machinist67]

do not buy from Hudson, I only bought from D&G Vermont.

[Gary R]

The 4-10 taps or "strive for five" is the recommendation for setting up all 5/16 laterals and using a vacuum pump. It would be better to keep the tap count higher using the 3/16. Like the others have said, you want to keep a continuous sap column in the 3/16. I have about 20 taps in each line. I don't know what the maximum number is that would be too much.

[steve J]

One thing I forgot to mention is I did got to the round table discussion in Middlebury about 3/16 line. And a couple of the panel members who set up this system last year were thinking of trying to vent the main line at the end this year. Unlike a normal vacuum system the main line plays no role other than to carry the sap all the vacuum is in the 3/16th line. So for those that want to experiment that is one thing being considered.

[pdr]

Has anyone tried tying a long, steep-sloped, 20-30 taps 3/16" line into an existing vacuum system? Would it work - and could such a setup support more taps on a single line? I wanted to try that this year, but couldn't locate the fittings when I had the time to do it.

[DrTimPerkins]

Has anyone tried tying a long, steep-sloped, 20-30 taps 3/16" line into an existing vacuum system? Would it work - and could such a setup support more taps on a single line? I wanted to try that this year, but couldn't locate the fittings when I had the time to do it.

Tim Wilmot and some cooperators will be doing some research on that approach this season.