Cotton Candy Machine

[SeanD]

I've been thinking about offering small amounts of cotton candy for sale or as samples to visitors to our sugar house. I don't want to jump right in with a high-end machine. Does anyone have any experience making cotton candy with these smaller, party-sized machines? There seems to be a level of small machine in the $50 range and then it jumps to $500 for entry-level commercial machines.

Some look like junk. Some look better. This one is made by Waring which makes other quality kitchen machines and on balance, it gets good reviews from the non-maple world.

http://www.amazon.com/Waring-CC150-Cotton-Candy-Maker/dp/B004VSSPTK

I'd appreciate any input.

Thanks,
Sean

[NH Maplemaker]

SeanD, we have a large cotton candy maker and even that doesn't always work 100% the way we would like it to ! But that looks to be a nice little unit for the money! I always read the reviews and go from there!!
If you could find some smaller clear plastic cup and lid, you could make up candy a little ahead of time. That way if machine is a little slow as stated in the reviews you would be ahead of the the game! As far as it being a hit with your customers ? It will be a big hit!!

[SeanD]

Thanks. I saw how popular it was and how easy it was to make at the Big E. Then right after that, it seemed like everyone was asking me if I had it. I was thinking about making it in advance and putting it in bags. I have some Scouts coming out to visit and thought it would be a nice thing to give them.

How do you price your cotton candy?

Sean

[maple flats]

If you read the reviews it seems pre heating and keeping it warm until completely empty is critical. I think you might need to use it at home unless your sugarhouse is far warmer than mine. Even when I'm in full boil and making syrup rather fast, it does not get very warm in my sugarhouse at outside temps under about 50 degrees, maybe 45. With temps in the mid 30's my wife never even unzips her winter coat as she boils.

[Mountain Winds Farm]

Cotton candy machines for maple have higher heat range bands in them to melt the maple sugar. Not sure you will get the results you want with a cheaper unit as it may not get hot enough. If you are doing any markets or other retail The cotton candy is a huge draw and you will see a quick return on you investment

[maple2]

we bought a G0ld Metal machine five years ago,around $600. works good for farmers markers and smaller shows. not fast enough for larger shows. To upgrade to a larger machine is over twice the money. A guy at Verona had an upgrade for our machine for $175

[SeanD]

That first one I posted has a 350 watt heater. This one has a 450 watt heater and can melt hard candies. That's got to be hot enough to melt maple sugar, right?

http://www.amazon.com/Nostalgia-Electrics-PCM805RETRORED-Series-Sugar-Free/dp/B004XD8FFW/ref=cm_cd_ql_qh_dp_t

Sean

[gmcooper]

SeanD to
We have a Gold Medal XA15 cotton candy machine that has an 1800 watt element and it is barely enough. we just bought the unit made for Maple cotton candy to help keep up. We rented a candy machine locally years ago and it barely worked at 5 to 1 sugar to maple sugar. I think we gummed it up after about 5 batches. Renter the next year had a policy they would not rent it for maple cotton candy after that year.
You can give one of those units a try but I would not expect much from them.

[Mountain Winds Farm]

gold medal makes a maple specific machine

[Tweegs]

We went with an entry level commercial machine made by Vortex. I think it has a 1000W head. The unit, with stand and bubble, set us back around $500. We’ve had no problems with it.

We bought the unit end of June last year, and by the time the farmer’s market season closed in Oct, we had made enough in sales to pay for it. And this from a small, low volume, single market.

Our market (maybe the State) had rules for making candy on the premises, so many in fact, that we just make the cotton at home night before the market and take it with us.

The cotton won’t last more than a day or two, so if you don’t sell it all you’re stuck with it, but the cost to produce is so small we could afford to give it to the other vendors if we didn’t sell out (would rather give away a dime than leave a dollar on the table).

When you consider our profit was based on having to buy the maple sugar, you can’t go wrong selling cotton, but get enough of a machine to handle your volume. Leave the $50 unit to the birthday party crowd.

[sugartree310]

Do not waste your money on the cheap machines, we did and it worked for a little while but wasted a lot of product and money and time, we went through two machines before we smartened up and bought the gold medal machine 3077 which is designed for maple cotton candy .

[NH Maplemaker]

So far we have only gave it away on Maple Weekend, so haven't got into selling it as a product yet!!


Thanks. I saw how popular it was and how easy it was to make at the Big E. Then right after that, it seemed like everyone was asking me if I had it. I was thinking about making it in advance and putting it in bags. I have some Scouts coming out to visit and thought it would be a nice thing to give them.

How do you price your cotton candy?

Sean

[SeanD]

Thanks for all the feedback. My big investment this year is going to be a maple candy machine, so I was hoping to avoid a second big investment on something I'm just experimenting with. It's encouraging to hear the break even for cotton candy is so quick, though. Maybe I can pull it off.

I'm interested in your pricing. Do you weigh the cotton candy or is there a general puffed up size you aim for like at the carnival?

Sean

[Tweegs]

We sell it at a buck an ounce and package in 1, 2 and 4 ounce bags.

Our mix is 4 ounces cane sugar to 1 ounce maple sugar.

In a 5 ounce mix we spend 62 cents (50 cents for maple sugar + 12 cents for 4 ounces cane) + packaging…call it a buck, and we yield about 4 ounces of cotton for a net profit of $3 per 5 ounce mix.

We sell $25~$30 worth per market/show.

We package in the smaller amounts because everyone, including the kids, have a buck in their pocket. Those that risk a buck to see if they like it usually come back for a bigger bag. We’ve had folks stop by every week for the $1 bag because it is just the right size for them.

[Bruce L]

Tweegs, I have been following this thread with interest, considering taking the plunge myself . What type of syrup do you use, I am assuming only the darker grades for stronger flavoring? Also, from your post I am reading you do not do up the cotton candy on the sticks like the summer fairs? Your bags that you describe, how do you purchase them? One ounce size sounds pretty small, but then again cotton candy doesn't weigh anything, so what would the dimensions roughly be?
Thanks for your help,Bruce

[Tweegs]

Tweegs, I have been following this thread with interest, considering taking the plunge myself . What type of syrup do you use, I am assuming only the darker grades for stronger flavoring? Also, from your post I am reading you do not do up the cotton candy on the sticks like the summer fairs? Your bags that you describe, how do you purchase them? One ounce size sounds pretty small, but then again cotton candy doesn't weigh anything, so what would the dimensions roughly be?
Thanks for your help,Bruce

You need to use maple sugar, not syrup. The sugar needs to be made from syrup with low invert sugar, usually light, but not always. Like I said, we buy our sugar because we don’t have a mixer that would survive the process…yet.

We get our bags from US plastics and use a 9X12 bag for the small stuff, they also sell a 4 ounce cotton candy bag. We use the same bag for both the 1 and 2 ounce, but have to mark them as to size, a day in the weather and they’ll look the same. We have a plastic ring to keep the bag open when we fill it, but I don’t remember from where it came.

We use a wooden spoon handle to roll the candy on, and then transfer to the bag. Try not to smoosh it going in, leave the bag looking as full as possible.

Moisture is the enemy. We wipe the spoon handle with a dry paper towel between rounds and make the candy indoors with the AC running at a good clip to reduce the humidity level.

Edit in: I should mention that we add just under 1.25 ounces of mix to the head at a time. When that spins off we’re left with about 1 ounce of candy. This way we can tell how much we put in each bag.

[maple2]

we use A dark.we sift our sugar, saving the smaller grain for cotton candy. seems to melt better than larger grains. We never use a stick. Just grab a circle of candy with two hands, fold in half, fold again and put in bag. Three handfulls fill a bag. Use gloves.

[wiam]

You don't have to use light for cotton candy. I prefer good flavor B. Since you are limited on how much maple you can use this gives more maple flavor and more importantly more color.

[pipeline]

SeanD to
We have a Gold Medal XA15 cotton candy machine that has an 1800 watt element and it is barely enough. we just bought the unit made for Maple cotton candy to help keep up. We rented a candy machine locally years ago and it barely worked at 5 to 1 sugar to maple sugar. I think we gummed it up after about 5 batches. Renter the next year had a policy they would not rent it for maple cotton candy after that year.
You can give one of those units a try but I would not expect much from them.

Which one do you like better? recommend? Any difference in the cotton candy between the two?

[SeanD]

We went with an entry level commercial machine made by Vortex. I think it has a 1000W head. The unit, with stand and bubble, set us back around $500. We’ve had no problems with it.

We bought the unit end of June last year, and by the time the farmer’s market season closed in Oct, we had made enough in sales to pay for it. And this from a small, low volume, single market.

Our market (maybe the State) had rules for making candy on the premises, so many in fact, that we just make the cotton at home night before the market and take it with us.

The cotton won’t last more than a day or two, so if you don’t sell it all you’re stuck with it, but the cost to produce is so small we could afford to give it to the other vendors if we didn’t sell out (would rather give away a dime than leave a dollar on the table).

When you consider our profit was based on having to buy the maple sugar, you can’t go wrong selling cotton, but get enough of a machine to handle your volume. Leave the $50 unit to the birthday party crowd.

Tweegs,

Thanks for all the advice on the machine. We followed your lead and went with the Vortex - without the stand, though. We made our first cotton candy tonight following your advice. It was a big hit with the kids and it was easy to do.

The cotton candy itself came out great, but some of the sugar flew to the side of the bowl right away. I scraped it up between batches and reused it. Is that normal or am I not preheating it long enough?

Thanks,
Sean

[Tweegs]

That’s our experience, too. We’ll have a pretty hefty ring of sugar in the bowl at the end.
My guess is that the head doesn’t really run hot enough for maple and this is the result.

Someone here mentioned to grind it up in a food processor and reuse it, we haven’t tried that yet.

My wife has, however, used it to make peanut brittle. Tastes good, but I don’t get much of a maple flavor from it. We gave thought to selling the peanut brittle, but then you have to deal with that whole nut allergy thing…labeling...warnings…etc…didn’t seem worth the risk/hassle to us.

We’re still trying to find a creative use for it, but may just grind it up in the end.

[SeanD]

Ok, good to know. It seemed like it was thrown out right away right when I turned it back on. The ball of candy was ready in about 10 seconds and the sugar was already there. It's still granular, so I just scraped it up and put it back in the mix.

You just do one scoop at a time, right? I think that comes out to a little over one tablespoon or half an ounce. I think that's the size sample I'll give out to little visitors.

Sean

[DaveB]

I'm replying to this thread because I too have a Vortex and I've noticed that some of the maple sugar does spin out right after I put a scoop into it. Has anyone else figured out a better way to avoid that? I was thinking of sifting my maple sugar and mixing it that way and I'm wondering if the more uniform size would help. Any thoughts? My sugar granule size sometimes varies and I'm wondering if that is the issue.

That being said, the cotton candy still tastes great!

[sugarsand]

My wife and I save the spun out sugar. We use it on ice cream, its a real treat and adds a little sass to vanila or maple walnut ice cream.

Sugarsand

[SeanD]

I still don't have a solution for it, but it's something I've lived with. I tried making cotton candy with the stuff thrown out and it puts out a denser gummier floss, so I stopped. When I use 4:1, I get a very big and light puff that is about the size of a youth basketball. The reused stuff made a puff about the size of a softball.

I've made a ton of it this season and I get 36 puffs or servings from the one cup of maple sugar and four cups of cane sugar. I figured out that the cup of maple sugar cost me $5 and the four cups of cane sugar cost $1. So, it costs me $6 to make $36 worth of product. The lost sugar is already factored into the cost, so I don't sweat it.

One of the things that has taken some time and thought is bagging the floss by myself. When my wife and I work together, she holds the bag and I drop the cotton candy in. While I turn to start the next serving, she ties and hangs the one she had. We work quickly and the bags look nice when they are sealed up right. The problem is, we really can't attend to the customers who come to the tables when the demand for cotton candy has been so high.

I think my next try to do it alone will be to cut a small hole in a box. I can put the dowel I use to spin the candy into the hole so the candy will stand upright. Then with two free hands I can slide the bag over the top. It will be slower, but I won't mess up the puffiness the way I have trying to do it all one handed. I'm open to ideas. Sugar makers are good at building the better mousetrap.

The other thing that I've had to figure out is cleaning. The pan and bubble clean out in a snap with hot water, but the head takes some work. I let it run to get as much sugar run out. Then I take a damp paper towel and hold it with tongs to rub the inside and outside of the head. I repeat the process once or twice and it looks and smells clean - nothing burned, but I'm wondering if there is an easier way to get inside there.

Sean

[wiam]

I just put a stainless kettle over the head and turn the heat all the way up. When you hear no more noise it is clean. Rinses right off the kettle and right back to making candy.

[maplwrks]

Williams' got it!! Use a 5 gallon bucket or large bowl and turn heat up high to "burn" out the head. You will hear the gobs of sugar hitting the sides of the bucket and it'll smoke like crazy. About a minute of this and the head is clean.

[GeneralStark]

Williams' got it!! Use a 5 gallon bucket or large bowl and turn heat up high to "burn" out the head. You will hear the gobs of sugar hitting the sides of the bucket and it'll smoke like crazy. About a minute of this and the head is clean.

This is certainly the "Big E" method at the VT SUgarmakers Booth, and it does work well.

Another trick used at the Big E Booth for packing the floss single handed is using bags that hang from the table so with one hand you can pull the bag open while with the other hand you can push the candy in the bag.

[SeanD]

Wow, I knew I'd get wisdom from this crowd. I'll have to give that a try. It seems scary and counter-intuitive, though. Does the head blacken from the burning off of the sugar?

[wiam]

Wow, I knew I'd get wisdom from this crowd. I'll have to give that a try. It seems scary and counter-intuitive, though. Does the head blacken from the burning off of the sugar?

No. Looks just like new

[lew]

Our local association had a cotton candy machine that could be rented for daily use. However, that policy has stopped now because of this "burning" off process. If done too long it will damage the head and lead to costly repairs, approximately $600 for this particular machine if memory serves me correctly. With my own machine, I take off the 2 nuts that hold the head together, remove the nuts that hold the heating bands electrical connections together and take it apart. Soak in hot water for a couple of hours, rinse, dry and reverse process. Pretty simple.

[wiam]

Our local association had a cotton candy machine that could be rented for daily use. However, that policy has stopped now because of this "burning" off process. If done too long it will damage the head and lead to costly repairs, approximately $600 for this particular machine if memory serves me correctly. With my own machine, I take off the 2 nuts that hold the head together, remove the nuts that hold the heating bands electrical connections together and take it apart. Soak in hot water for a couple of hours, rinse, dry and reverse process. Pretty simple.

I have burned off several machines besides my own. The problem is letting it run too long on high heat. Also the spinner neads to be rotating. Several 1000 bags are made by the VMSMA at Big E every year and those machines are burned off several times a day. Don't have time to soak them out.

Sounds like a lack of training or caring which happens with most rentals.......

[lew]

Not sure of what was the actual culprit, caring or experience, but I do know the outcome. Having been that close to the situation, I prefer to soak.

[GeneralStark]

While on the subject, any ideas for places that rent a cotton candy machine in NW VT? I have been keeping an eye on Craigs List for a used machine, but nothing. Where have you guys found them?

[TheMapleMoose]

Ditto on the burn off method. It's a good way to ruin your head. We take ours apart and soak it

[maplwrks]

Like Wiam said, we make 1000s' of bags of cotton candy each year and burn them out on a regular basis. We will be running 4 machines side x side this year and burn outs are critical to keeping these machines running. This is performed every 90 mins or so, and is done when the machine starts to slow on production. The head is as empty as possible when we do this and is only burned out for maybe a minute. With all that being said, almost every machine is torn down and cleaned a couple of times during the fair. It is much easier to tear down the machine and rebuild it than to soak it. Not that soaking doesn't work, it's just not practical in this situation. We cannot afford to have a machine down for more than a half hour. We use the heavy duty bands in our machines, the ones made for maple, they make a huge difference also. We also keep a rather large stock of parts for these machines on hand at all times.

I've rented cotton candy machines at Taylor Rental in Middlebury in the past--great people to work with.

[GeneralStark]

Mike - Thanks for the advice. I rent lots of stuff through them. I'll look into it.

[lew]

maplewrks,

what's the difference between soaking the head and tearing one down? Also, what is your procedure for burning one out?

[maplwrks]

Hey Lew-- no difference, only we don't soak the head. We gently pull the bands out of the head(if they can be saved) and burn them out on a stone. This is done by hooking them up to power and burning the sugar out of them. Just giving everything a good cleaning. When we burn them out, we run the machine with the heat on max. with a 5 gallon bucket over the spinning head.. All of the gobbed up sugar will be expelled from the machine and collects on the sides of the bucket. You'll hear the sugar hitting the bucket. We run this on high for about 1 minute and then shut the heat off and remove the bucket while the machine cools. It'll smoke like crazy while we are doing this. once the machine cools a little, we adjust the heat back to where we normally run it and go back to work.

[lew]

Thanks maplewrks. I think where a problem may have occured with our associations machine may have occured is they were burning it out by placing a cream jar lid over the opening where you put your sugar in and not allowing air to flow through the band's. That probably overheated it

[DaveB]

I just finished my first big event with the Vortex and wanted to report back on how I made out. I think it worked well. I ran the machine for 6 hours straight with a couple of ten minute breaks to let it cool down but it warmed back up quickly. It did have a nice crusty ring around the edge by the end of the day but I had no problem making multiple cones, one right after the other at times. This was my first time using a machine and at first I tried to pick up the floss with the cone vertically but I actually found it easier to keep it horizontal and just keep spinning the floss on the cone. I made about 80 cones in the 6 hours we were there so it wasn't too bad!

One thing I did notice was that I could not make the cones up ahead of time. If I made cones and put them in a stand, after about 10 minutes they seemed to start "fading" or almost "melting". However, if I made them fresh, customers had no problems with them. Several even commented that it was the best maple cotton candy they had had!

Overall, I think it was a good investment and this our first piece of equipment for our maple equipment rental business so I feel good about that!

[wiam]

I just finished my first big event with the Vortex and wanted to report back on how I made out. I think it worked well. I ran the machine for 6 hours straight with a couple of ten minute breaks to let it cool down but it warmed back up quickly. It did have a nice crusty ring around the edge by the end of the day but I had no problem making multiple cones, one right after the other at times. This was my first time using a machine and at first I tried to pick up the floss with the cone vertically but I actually found it easier to keep it horizontal and just keep spinning the floss on the cone. I made about 80 cones in the 6 hours we were there so it wasn't too bad!

One thing I did notice was that I could not make the cones up ahead of time. If I made cones and put them in a stand, after about 10 minutes they seemed to start "fading" or almost "melting". However, if I made them fresh, customers had no problems with them. Several even commented that it was the best maple cotton candy they had had!

Overall, I think it was a good investment and this our first piece of equipment for our maple equipment rental business so I feel good about that!

It needs to go directly into a bag if you want any shelf life. If it is not handled much it will last for a few days in a sealed bag

[SeanD]

I just finished my first big event with the Vortex and wanted to report back on how I made out. I think it worked well. I ran the machine for 6 hours straight with a couple of ten minute breaks to let it cool down but it warmed back up quickly. It did have a nice crusty ring around the edge by the end of the day but I had no problem making multiple cones, one right after the other at times. This was my first time using a machine and at first I tried to pick up the floss with the cone vertically but I actually found it easier to keep it horizontal and just keep spinning the floss on the cone. I made about 80 cones in the 6 hours we were there so it wasn't too bad!

One thing I did notice was that I could not make the cones up ahead of time. If I made cones and put them in a stand, after about 10 minutes they seemed to start "fading" or almost "melting". However, if I made them fresh, customers had no problems with them. Several even commented that it was the best maple cotton candy they had had!

Overall, I think it was a good investment and this our first piece of equipment for our maple equipment rental business so I feel good about that!

That's great! I can barely keep up with demand when we do farmers markets. I try to make and bag as many as possible in advance to give myself a cushion, but I'm still at it for most of the time. That's the ONLY thing I don't like about making cotton candy. I bet you were beat by the end of the day!

I have had good results by spinning the cone (I use a long-handled wooden spoon) in my hand while also going counter clockwise around the head. I also do that just once or twice and then hold it horizontally just past the head, spinning it.

Do you have a bubble? Even with it, I am covered with a thin layer of floss. I've taken to wearing an apron and a long-sleeved t-shirt and hat to cover up a bit, but my face gets a good coating.

Do you shut off the head when putting a new scoop in?

Sean

[DaveB]

That's great! I can barely keep up with demand when we do farmers markets. I try to make and bag as many as possible in advance to give myself a cushion, but I'm still at it for most of the time. That's the ONLY thing I don't like about making cotton candy. I bet you were beat by the end of the day!

I have had good results by spinning the cone (I use a long-handled wooden spoon) in my hand while also going counter clockwise around the head. I also do that just once or twice and then hold it horizontally just past the head, spinning it.

Do you have a bubble? Even with it, I am covered with a thin layer of floss. I've taken to wearing an apron and a long-sleeved t-shirt and hat to cover up a bit, but my face gets a good coating.

Do you shut off the head when putting a new scoop in?

Sean

We went with the cones because I thought we could benefit from people walking around with them but I can also see the benefits of bags. I should try making some up the day before and see how that goes.

I don't have the bubble but I don't think it went that bad. I had some on me, but not too bad.

I left the unit spinning as I added the scoop. I held the cone in my right hand and the scoop in the left. It would start putting out floss a few seconds after I put the sugar in so I had to be ready!

I need a better sign though. I think that I'm going to have a banner made up to go in back of the canopy that really emphasizes maple cotton candy. I think that would help because I think people saw that we were making cotton candy but it wasn't until they were at our table that they realized what it was that we were making.

[SeanD]

Don't worry too much about the signage - though a small investment does help. I hang the bags on a string under the tent and its a nice visual. People walking around with it and the smell are the best advertising. Our first day went okay, then bang. People were asking for it by name while we are still setting up. The same thing is starting to happen with our cream. People don't know what it is and then as soon as they get a taste, I can't keep up.

Sean

[GeneralStark]

What are you guys using for ratio of cane sugar to maple sugar when you are making cotton candy with a vortex?

[SeanD]

What are you guys using for ratio of cane sugar to maple sugar when you are making cotton candy with a vortex?

I have been using 4:1 all season, but after talking with the good people at the Vermont booth at the Big E, I'm going to switch to 5:1. It is easier to handle in our usually-humid New England, yet it still has the maple flavor.

Sean

[Bruce L]

Just livening up this thread again,looked at the Vortex machine on ebay, sells for a lot less than the Gold Medal model, but longevity wise and ease of use, no breakdowns etc is the Gold Medal worth getting instead? Also found the Gold medal on Katom restaurant supply cheaper than ebay, but comes with a non-metallic bowl instead.Am i better to go with a metallic bowl?
Thanks in advance

[SeanD]

I can't compare the two b/c I only have the Vortex. I like having the stainless bowl b/c it cleans up nicely with hot water. It comes with an extra belt and fuses, but I haven't had to replace anything yet.

The only thing I haven't liked is that I can't get the cover off to the part where you put the sugar. It has four screws and two of them are absolutely gunned on and I started to strip the heads. So, I just heat it to clean it and wipe the inside with a moist paper towel on the end of some tongs. The inside has a black layer of carbon like a wok that I'd like to clean off, but it doesn't impart any off flavors into the candy, so it's likely no big deal.

Sean

[red maples]

I might be investing in one as well. Starting to do Farmers markets and I know cotton candy is a big seller. now does anyone know anything about the Paragon 26" cotton candy machine. it clames to be able to do 200 cones an hr. thats pretty good especially at $500.00

[maple maniac65]

If you want to compare a Paragon to a Gold Medal machine and are up this way give me a shout I have both here. I prefer the Gold medal one.

[Tweegs]

Sean,
To get those screws out I’ll turn the machine on and let it warm up about 20 seconds. Shut it off and grab the head with an oven mitt. The screws will usually back right out when the head is warm.

Picked up a bag of replacement screws from the local hardware and keep them with the machine. I’ll replace the screw if the head starts to get buggered up.

[Bruce L]

Sean, is this the same unit that is on ebay,seems pretty cheap compared to the Gold Medal unit?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Great-Northern-Popcorn-Cotton-Candy-Machine-Commercial-Floss-Maker-Electric-NEW-/191394345586