Seeking recommendation on an evaporator and pan combo

[Balsam Hills]

Hi all,

I've been sugaring for about 15 years and have slowly expanded to about 400 gravity fed taps. Up until now I've used a homemade concrete arch with a 2x6 divided pan. I don't anticipate expanding much more than where I'm at.

I would like to become more efficient as my job and family duties limit my ability to spend all night boiling. Do you have any recommendations for an optimal efficient set up (i.e. evaporator/pan combo)?

Much appreciated,

Scott

[jmayerl]

I would recommend that you get ahold of Jim at smoky lake maple for a few reasons, 1st off you can jump on 21 and be at his place in probably under 3 hours( so he is a local manufacturer). 2nd you can ask any of us that own his pans or equipment at we will all say they are top notch works or art( you won't even want to boil on it they look so nice. 3rd is price, I bought my pans a few years ago and spent much lest than if I bought from a major manufacturer. 4th he is just a nice guy that is very passionate about maple( he gave up making syrup for the last few years to make sure his customers had there pans and service during the season.

Depending on how much time you have to boil, you might consider something in the size of a 2x8, or a 3x8. Again it all depends on how much time you have. I run a high efficacy 2x7 and get almost 50gph. I had 1100 taps last year and boiled all day every day but I have the time. You can always get a hobby RO and make it also very manageable with time constraints.

[adk1]

Well I have a leader 2x6 king pan evap. I run a little over 200 taps. If you are limited on Time I wouldn't recommend another 2x6. For your 400 taps you can figure 400 gallons of sap to boil on a decent run. How many hours you wanna boil? If it's 4 hours you will need an evap that can process 100gph. I think, you would be looking at a 3x10 or something like that. What is your budget? How much room do you have?

[Balsam Hills]

Thanks for the info. Budget is around $2500. Luckily I have all the room in the world. Not sure if an RO would pay for itself in a reasonable amount of time. So many factors to consider making my head spin.

[Balsam Hills]

Thank you. Do you think there's a reasonable payback for an investment in a RO? Also, do you like a raised or drop flue? What do you think of the hybrid pans?

[Sugarmaker]

Scott,
First let me welcome you and commend you on boiling raw sap from 400 taps on a block arch. Man you are dedicated! Any new evaporator is probably going to be a great up grade. You mentioned R.O. I would say you are right there at 400 taps the point where the R.O. makes good sense. You could probably buy the R.O and continue with the block arch and get lots more sleep! Just boggles my mind that you are boiling that much. What is a normal gallons of sap per run? I would guess your boil rate is about 20 GPH? So on a average run on 400 taps say 400 gallons of sap. = 20 hours of boiling! I assume you have lots of boiling help??
Most of the answers are on here for your immediate needs. But your not new to making syrup. Sounds like you have been doing it a while. Is the tap count going to continue to grow? do you want to make more syrup each year? You have lots of up grade options. for the $2500 I would say look at a Deer Run brand RO first. (note I dont have one) You may not be able to get the evaporator of the size you need for that money? But If I was to recommend a straight evaporator with out the .O. I would say 3 x 8 dropped or raised flue would boil about 65-80 gph for you right out of the box. Lowest cost stainless soldered evaporator would be Atlee Miller in upper mid PA. The prices then go from there. You might check with David Yokum (SP?) local to me in NW PA. he build custom arches and pans. Mason build great stuff. Sunrise products looking real good. Top of the line would be Jim at Smokey Lake and or Patrick P.L and then the big guys. Yes kind of mind boggling. Have you boiled on a regular rig before or been around one? Sometimes its the comfort factor? They will all make syrup. Lots of different features just like buying a new truck:)
Hope this helps a little.
Pay back would be in hours of sleep gained:)
I like drop flue only because I have one. Lots of raised flues do just as good of job. Hybrid. Best of both worlds and you get more boiling area. That's what its about. Like buying that new truck most folks dont trade rigs every year. Ok there are some that do:) Everyone will have different opinions on what evaporator is best. They keep making positive improvements and what you buy today will be new and better tomorrow.

Regards,
Chris

[kiteflyingeek]

Scott,

I'm pretty new to making syrup but I will say that Jim Schumacher at Smoky Lake Maple is a great guy to talk to about your options. He is likely to be super buried right now trying to get orders out the door but I would recommend any of his products -- I just purchased a 2x6.5 drop flue from him for just a little over your current budget. If you are on a flat pan, adding the drop/raised flues will really helps your rate.

Good luck with the upgrades.

--andrew

[Balsam Hills]

Great stuff Chris! Not sure if my money is better spent on RO or a new evaporator-what do you think? Also, what are your thoughts on the hybrid pan vs separate pans?

[Spanielslovesappin]

From a purely economical standpoint (cost of fuel to produce a pound of sugar) you can not afford to not run an RO. Also your firewood is not free, it has a very real cost in labor and taxes. I vote buy a small hobby RO this season, see exactly what that does to your boiling time, then size the new evaporator based on this for next season or later. You can buy a much smaller evaporator (read lower cost and less fire wood) if you take our 50-75% of the water up front with the RO and kudos for boiling 400 taps on flat pan thats dedication but now it's time to reward yourself with the gift of sleep and less time spent producing fire wood!

[Balsam Hills]

Amen to that! Thank you!!!

[Sugarmaker]

Balsam hill,
I was standing in Ray G's Deer Run Maple RO shop today. His 125 gph R.O is right at $2500. My advice would be for you to get on his list for next season.
Do you have a sugarhouse, for a new rig and or R.O.?
You mention hybrid pans. tell me more? Most evaporators have front and rear pans. Rear pan does the heavy boiling. front pan finishes the syrup. Tell me what a hybrid pan is to you and then I will probably have a comment, I usually do.:)
Regards,
Chris

[Balsam Hills]

Hey Chris, that's funny. You were probably standing in Ray's shop when I called him this afternoon.:lol: Anyway, he has a 125 gph with expansion ports for $2800 but I have to get in line for 2015. I'm curious to hear what he's concocting for $500. I am a backyard sugarer yet. The RO would be set up in my garage with the sweet pumped to my backyard for cooking.

The hybrid pan I'm aware of is the Smoky Lake model. Here is his description:

The Smoky Lake Hybrid Hobby pan will evaporate 250% faster than a standard flat pan. The pan has eight drop flues in the back and two finishing compartments in the front. Being that it is one pan you don't need to worry about gaskets and there are no external transition fittings which cool your sap down. It is as simple as just replacing your flat pan. The draw off valve and finishing thermometer are included. Every pan comes with brackets and ports for a float box so you can add one now or down the road.8333

[Sugarmaker]

Balsam hill,
Small maple world:), Ray said he got several calls yesterday, I believe he said he had a cut off date of Dec 15 2013 for his RO's to be delivered for this season.
I understand the hybrid pan from Jim, thanks for the picture. That would be a good upgrade for you too. But if your looking for just a evaporator it would be too small for the number of taps. my 2 cents.
Regards,
Chris

[Balsam Hills]

Do u think the pan would be the right size if I added a RO?

[Sugarmaker]

That's what a lot of guys are doing. Talk to Jim Brown, he has 1000+ taps with RO and boiling on 2x6 with steam away.
The trend seems to be to down size the rig and get the R.O sized for the amount of taps you have. I am sure that the Smoky Lake pan would be a nice upgrade from the flat one your using. As comparison the Attlee Miller prices a year or so ago was approx $2500 for a 2-1/2 x 8 soldered pans and arch.
Regards,
Chris