how big of a motor?????

[whitetail farms]

hello I just acquired a sihi pump rated for about 3000 taps im not sure of the model # but I was wondering if a 1 1/2 hp would be a big enough motor to run the pump, thanks nick

[madmapler]

If you're figuring at 100 taps per cfm thats 30 cfms. It'll probably need at least 3hp to run or more especially if its a 2 stage pump. More info would be helpful.

[whitetail farms]

its a single stage, im only going to have a 150 taps on the system and a 3 foot sap ladder just before the releaser.

[madmapler]

If the motor is undersized its probably not capable of running the pump at the right rpm. I dont know what effect that will have on the hgs. If my thinking is correct it wont be sucking much air with 150 taps so it will want to turn harder. You cant get a model#? How about some dimensions and the inlet/outlet sizes?

[JoeJ]

When I order my first vacuum pump from an un-named Big maple supplier, I needed vacuum for 1,000 taps. I received a 3 HP vacuum head with a 1 1/2 hp motor. Didn't put out much vacuum.
The tech that came to check the problem spotted it right away and went and bought a 3 hp motor. Worked fine after that.

[whitetail farms]

okay,I can get all the numbers off it some point today the problem is there is only 115 volts in my sugarhouse so I need to find a 115 motor that's 3hp and I haven't run across any yet,the guy I got the vacuum from gave me 3hp 220 motor with it cause he thought it could be switched over to low voltage but it cant.

[nymapleguy607]

Best bet would be to either update the service to your sap house to 220v, or locate the pump some where that has 220v. I don't believe you would have enough power at motor start up. With a pump that big and for so few taps I would just locate the pump near 220v power and run an 1-1/2" dry line to run the releaser.

[whitetail farms]

okay with all the snow lately I didn't get a chance to get to the shack and get some numbers of the pump but maybe ill just use the motor I have and hook it up in my garage, and run 1 inch black pipe for about 400 feet to the releaser, just need to make sure the water will stay cold enough in my heated garage.

[BreezyHill]

Definitely set the pump on the floor in the garage to use the cooler temp air down low. You may want to turn down or even off the heat while it is running and may need to open a window if the unit starts running a little warm.
Pump set under a window will allow the air to come in and down to the pump for cooling. 3hp is the best for that pump. To small of a motor and the motor will run harder, hotter and shorten its life. Hard working motors also eat bushings and bearings faster; due to the amount of force on the belt.

Ben

[whitetail farms]

finally got back to getting the vacuum hooked up today ive decided to go with the 3 hp motor and run it on 220 up in my garage and run 1 inch black plastic pipe back to the releaser ,the pumps model number is 3404,can any body help me figure out how to hook up the cooling water intake I was told to just set the outlet of the tank level with the inlet on the pump but how will I know how much water is really going in there? also the motor only has 2 wire to hook the plug and cord to but the outlet in my wall has 3 wires how would I go about wiring this? Thank you guys for all your help and good luck this season
,Nick

[madmapler]

Are you cycling the water back to the tank? I'm not clear on your set up. Is the motor configured for 220 or 110? Some motors can go both ways.

[whitetail farms]

yes the water is cycled right back into a 60 gal tank, im just not sure on what height to set the tank, and the motor is for 220/208

[lpakiz]

Whitetail,
Two of the terminals in your outlet are hot. One is not. That one will be the safety ground. Green is recognized as ground in these circuits. A voltmeter or other tester will show 110 volts from either of the two hot terminals to the safety ground AND/BUT 220 volts to each other. These two 110 volt hots go to the two wires on your motor. Make sure the motor is configured for 220. As mentioned above, many smaller motors can be set up 110 or 220. You should have your motor safety grounded, either by a green wire, or in some (all?) cases, by flexible or rigid metal conduit.

[madmapler]

yes the water is cycled right back into a 60 gal tank, im just not sure on what height to set the tank Honestly, Until now I've only used vane pumps. I'll be using a couple liquid rings this season though and from what I've gathered is as long as it can gravity feed into the pump you're alright. You just would'nt want it too high for the return but that should'nt be a problem. Maybe someone with more experience could correct or verify.

[whitetail farms]

So what should I do with the ground wire tap it in to the motor frame? the wire im gonna use for the plug has 2 grounds one is white and the other is bare copper. Thanks for your help Nick

[Super Sapper]

There should be a green screw to attach the bare wire to for a ground. The white wire should not be connected. Use a wire nut to cover the end of the white wire.

[PATheron]

Whitetail. Once you have the electric figured out just take the output of your pump and let it go back in the tank and when you do make sure the connector at the top of the pump is steel or something strong. Don't use plastic pvc there because if you glue a 90 to shoot it back in the tank it might blow apart someday because of the force of the air from time to time. On the input side you will have the line to your releaser and what Ive found works good for me is I plumb in a half inch piece of water line to stick down in the coolant water. Seems to be a good size to suck in the water without getting too much. If you use to big a water line you get too much water and pump wont work good. Proper way to do it is use the half inch line and put a course filter on it to filter the heavies and also a water flow meter and regulater the water flow to pump specs which Im guessing for that pump might be 4 or 5 gallons per minute Im not too sure youd have to call the pump manufacture to find out. Also point the output pipe away from your house or whatever to keep noise down. Then keep cold water coming into the tank like take your garden hose and turn it down to just a trickle and let it run into it all the time and have a little overflow or put a little sump pump in the water and run some water line from it and loop it out on the ground or in a ditch and back in the tank to cool the water. Warm water equals half the pump power. Its going to be real loud in your garage might want the output line just under the water level to keep noise down. Manufacturer says not to do this but I do too keep noise down and hasn't seemed to hurt anything. I kind of just let the output line float on top of the water. Hope this helps. Theron

[whitetail farms]

okay thanks guys, do you think it okay to run 1 inch black plastic pipe to carry my vacuum 300 feet to the releaser?

[GeneralStark]

okay thanks guys, do you think it okay to run 1 inch black plastic pipe to carry my vacuum 300 feet to the releaser?

Totally depends upon how much mainline you have connected to the releaser, how many taps, how many cfms the pump can produce and the vacuum level you hope to run at but probably not. Bigger is always better so I would say use at least 1.25" pipe, but without the specifics of your system it is hard to say for sure.

[madmapler]

okay thanks guys, do you think it okay to run 1 inch black plastic pipe to carry my vacuum 300 feet to the releaser? According to the NY tubing and vacuum manual, with a 30cfm pump and a 1" line run 300' you'll have 12cfms left at the other end. That should be plenty for 450 taps but you are losing a lot of energy. With a 1.25" line you'll have 19cfms at the other end. Better for overcoming small leaks and such.

[GeneralStark]

Based on a quick google search, a Sihi 3404 with a 3 hp motor likely produces 20 CFM @ 15" Vac.

http://www.sugaringequipment.elapierre.com/produits_en.asp?id_categorie=358&id_groupeproduit=299&page=1

Without the performance curve for the pump (which you could probably find online), it is hard to say how many CFM the pump will produce at 25" (if you do want to run it for high vac and why wouldn't you) but probably closer to 10 CFM.

In terms of the wiring of this pump, you should get all the info off the plate on the motor. May the motor be three phase?

[madmapler]

According to the same manual a 15cfm pump will give you 10 cfms at 300' with 1" and 13 cfms with 1.25". The chart does'nt go below 15 cfms.

[whitetail farms]

there is only about 500 feet of mainline in this woods with 150 taps on this system, and the motor is single phase.

[madmapler]

You have way plenty cfms for that amount of taps even with 1" line. You could do just fine with a lot smaller pump like a gast 2565 or a 2065 with a 1 or 1.5 hp motor. They are rotary vane, pretty affordable, pretty quiet, and no water to run. You would pull 25" easily with that amount of taps. Something to think about down the road maybe.

[whitetail farms]

yeah I just saw an add on on a gast pump that also has a compressor attached to it, with a 3 hp motor, says it came off a printing press and is capable of pulling 20 inch at 11 cfm,I believe its a gast 1550

[madmapler]

You would'nt even need a 3hp with that. A 1hp would do. I have 1550 as well as 4 other gast pumps that put out higher hgs and cfms. If you ever decide to go that route let me know. I've become quite the gast connoisseur. I really like them and I think their perfect for up to 400 or so taps. You can even double them up I think. Gast pumps are also used as compressors. Is that the pump that the guy from easthampton, mass has on craigslist? If it is then its 2 1550s. They've been on there for over a year. $200 I believe. Its a good deal but as I said there are better gast pumps to be had.

[whitetail farms]

yes that's it, do you think both pump could be ran together on a 115 volt motor like 1 or 2 hp?,I still want to hook up my sihi for my woods this year but maybe I could put this one in a another one of my woods if I could find a releaser

[madmapler]

I have'nt done that yet but I've asked around the trader and nobody can see why not. A 2HP might cut it. The thing of it is though is that unless you're going to hook up to 200 or more taps you dont need all the cfms that 2 pumps will give you. Theres a gast 2067 listed on ebay right now that has a single phase 1 hp. motor attached for $350 obo. Mufflers and all. Theres no oiling the 67 series either although they dont use much anyway. This pump is 17 cfm at free flow but is capable of more (about 6hgs) than the 1550. Once again it really depends on the # of taps. These pumps work great with a bender releaser.

[heus]

Since talk has turned to Gast pumps... I really like my Gast 3040 rotary dry vane pump. No high vac but it runs at 21" effortlessly and is rated at 30-40 cfms. Got it for $80 off eBay. Run by a 2 hp marathon electric motor.