Vacuum decision- need help

[stewardsdairy]

Looking at Leaders Flood system Vacuum pumps. Flood system with oil cooling kit is advertised to do 27" and standard flood system oil cooled pump will do 22-24. One is a kit set up and ready to go, the other looks like it may need additions, such as moisture trap. The price difference is $3000, what makes more sense. System will have about 1800 taps on it when it is complete.

[unc23win]

Well I know things are always on a budget but more Vacuum makes more sense. You will get approximately 1 gallon of sap more for every inch over 20" so the 27" would get you 3 more gallons per tap than the 24" pump. So 1000 taps would be 3,000 more gallons of sap so that's what 60 more gallons of syrup you wouldn't get the $3000 year one if you had a 1,000 taps but with 2,000 you would.

[Sunday Rock Maple]

We bought the flood with the cooling kit all set up with the moisture trap on a skid. It was the hardest decision we made (lots of opportunities to justify trimming features and costs, and yes money was a very big factor) but after our first run we knew it was the best decision we had made with the new install -- and after two seasons we still feel that way. From what I read here there are other good options as well but we have no regrets with this one. In summary my advise would be to get the most pump that you possibly can.

[Thad Blaisdell]

Do you have water available at all to run a water cooled system? With that you don't need any of the other stuff. No moisture trap cooling system none of it. All you need is a 100 gallon Rubbermaid tote. And some form of running water. A brook, a pond, etc...

[Buffalo Creek Sugar Camp]

I have several of the flood vane pumps with coolers and like them very well. In my one woods I removed a water cooled single stage ring pump and installed a vane pump with a cooler. They were both rated the same size cfm. It took a day to swap them out. I checked the vacuum level on the ring pump before removal, and checked the vacuum level on the flood vane pump after install. Gained 5" vacuum. Now this was in the fall and I am sure there were a lot of leaks and drops popped off but this test sold me on the flood vane pumps with coolers. If you want to save money, contact D&G for the pump. They sell the exact same unit as Leader. Much cheaper.

[Bruce L]

We currently have a de Laval with flood kit, one year under our belt with it, consistently ran over 25 " vacuum at releaser, more sap than our previous system could ever pull in. Leader priced us for possibly the same unit you are talking about, but I am thinking next step will be Indiana vacuum, nothing but positive reviews and cheaper equals quicker return on investment.

[unc23win]

We currently have a de Laval with flood kit, one year under our belt with it, consistently ran over 25 " vacuum at releaser, more sap than our previous system could ever pull in. Leader priced us for possibly the same unit you are talking about, but I am thinking next step will be Indiana vacuum, nothing but positive reviews and cheaper equals quicker return on investment.

I agree for the money and the reviews and all I think Indiana is the way to go. Not only that the 100CFM @ $6295 Oil $5400 for water sealed and that unit is cheaper than the 75 CFM and the cost between a 100 and 150 CFM is $700 seems pretty darn good comparing to the SIHI pumps available through Lapierre which the biggest listed is 54 CFM @ $9000. I know other huys have the Kinney and I am sure some guys got deals. Although I am not sure about the time frame as far as orderiung for 2014. http://www.harrissugarbush.com/vacuum.htm

[syrup2nv]

I have a 7.5HP Vane Flood w/reclaim, moisture trap and the add on radiator and cooling fan. All mounted on a metal skid. I ran it at 27" all last season and it would maintain whatever temp the fan was set at. I ran it at 100 degrees. Never heated up any higher, even at the end of the season when air temp was warm. The nice thing about the vane flood pump is its a steep curve pump. Meaning if its hooked to a leaky system, or you encounter leaks often, it can still maintain a good vacuum level and move CFM's.

I agree with Jeremy, contact a D&G Rep if you want to save some money. Same unit! I use Kent Hollow Maple Equipment.

[Buffalo Creek Sugar Camp]

One thing to keep in mind with the Indiana water cooled pumps is that they are self contained. since the same water is constantly recirculated through the pump, it generates heat. When the water heats up, the pump does not pull as much vacuum. I had one 2 years ago. It was steaming as it always did, and I dumped cold water in the tank since some liquid evaporated. Just by adding the cold water, vacuum increased by 1". You can solve this with an oil cooled, but remember they are single stage. Also, I had several Indiana pumps and had to replace the lovejoy couplers every other year.

[stewardsdairy]

Thanks for all the information. I did go with Leader and their cooled system. Extra sap should pay for extra cost in two years.

[yards1520]

Jeremy, how are those lovejoy couplers to replace? pretty simple or a pita?

[Buffalo Creek Sugar Camp]

The lovejoy couplers are not really that hard to replace. The problem is, the way the frame is made, you can't really tell if you are in alignment.

[Walling's Maple Syrup]

One thing to keep in mind with the Indiana water cooled pumps is that they are self contained. since the same water is constantly recirculated through the pump, it generates heat. When the water heats up, the pump does not pull as much vacuum. I had one 2 years ago. It was steaming as it always did, and I dumped cold water in the tank since some liquid evaporated. Just by adding the cold water, vacuum increased by 1". You can solve this with an oil cooled, but remember they are single stage. Also, I had several Indiana pumps and had to replace the lovejoy couplers every other year. I can't comment on the water cooled Indiana pumps as I have never owned one but I do have a oil-cooled 75 cfm unit on a 4400 tap woods and ran 27+ " all last year. Even the farthest taps from the sugarhouse(over 3000') away ran consistently 27" everytime I checked. This year I am changing to a 100 cfm Indiana pump- just changing pump out ; motor radiator and everything else stay the same because I now have 6000 on this woods behind the sugarhouse.
Neil

[sapman]

The lovejoy couplers are not really that hard to replace. The problem is, the way the frame is made, you can't really tell if you are in alignment.

I know what you're talking about. Had that issue with the 30 cfm unit I had. But the 60 cfm had a bigger, rubber-type coupling, that held up very well.

As to cooling, did you run the loop of plastic pipe like Art recommends? I had over 250' out, and never really had any heating up issues.

[rayi]

Is there one that works well with lower vacuum. I have a Gast pump that only pulls about 22. Also is there one of the vacuum shuts off will continue as a gravity system