Came into some money! Help me spend it!

[Starting Small]

So I just sold a 73 Mustang convertible that I have not driven much since my two daughters came along. I am going to take about $2,000 of that and put it towards tryin to get setup on vacuum (No more buckets). I have had a difficult time finding used equipment so I am thinking of buying new. I am going to need mainline, laterals, taps (any suggestions on types) etc. I am thinking of 150-200 taps this year but increasing every year for foreseeable future. Can I purchase a new Airtech Piston Pump ($670) and a hobby releaser ($600), just connect them and be good to go? I am assuming I need a moisture trap but do I really need to spend $75 on one like the one listed on this site? Any other suggestions of what I should spend some cash on would be appreciated. Thanks!
-Dave

Current setup includes:
2X4 Drop flu evap.
275 gal. tote
350 Gal tote
Bunch of little stuff I have gathered from over the years like hydrometer, canning tank, etc.

[Yellow Wings Maple]

Save yourself some money and get one of these for $500.00. no releaser required. that thing should be able to handle at least 400 taps.

8026

http://www.thebosworthco.com/pproduct.php?ID=GE-0401D-0

[Starting Small]

Thanks, I have heard in the past that these will not handle vac above 18 inches or so and that they cannot be allowed to freeze. Is this still true or have they updated the models? This is an option though that might be worth exploring.
-Dave

[spud]

Thanks, I have heard in the past that these will not handle vac above 18 inches or so and that they cannot be allowed to freeze. Is this still true or have they updated the models? This is an option though that might be worth exploring.
-Dave

I thought FlatLander had one of these but I may be wrong. I almost remember someone saying they were getting over 20 inches of vac with there's. If thats the case maybe it would be a good way of entering the vacuum world at an affordable price.

Spud

[unc23win]

Seems like there were a couple of guys reporting steady 20" with the Guzzler. It seems like a good way for you to get into vacuum 1. no releaser needed 2. its brand new so no used pump (to fail). Then I would spend the rest of the money either on evaporator efficiency or more taps or both considering the Guzzler is rated for 500 taps. Then another year or so depending on your addiction you can jump to a bigger vacuum and releaser and go for 26".

[Yellow Wings Maple]

i have seen it somewhere around 23". also in the pic - that one is setup so if a freeze is coming you remove the unit with the cam locks and keep it from freezing.

[maplefrank]

if you want help............i could use some to pay for my new syrup pan!!!!!!!! lol

[NH Maplemaker]

Just wondering why if you have electric to run the pump why you wouldn't just build an insulated box over pump. Place a small light bulb in box to protect from freeze up? Could even put light on an inline timer!

[whalems]

I have no experience with these pumps but have heard that you cant run them at all until sap is flowing. any ice thru them can tear the diaphragm. maybe someone else will chime in on this that has used them.

[BreezyHill]

There may be an easier method...good old fashioned heat tape on a length of threaded copper tubing on the mains just before it enters the pump with a screen on the at the pump. Over size the tubing and you have a small balance tank built in. The screen will stop any ice that could damage the diaphragm and the heat tape will warm the sap to melt the ice. Most tapes run if the temp gets down to 35, some good ones have an adjustable temp. You could also insulate the tubing to make it more efficient with pipe insulation at HD. I would use the fiber glass product as it wont melt if the tape gets toasty. Hydrometer is a must!

[Scribner's Mountain Maple]

I have used one of these pumps for just one season. I had no problems with it. Only pulled 17" which could have been partly due to the line installer (me as a rookie). It worked fine and I never let it freeze. If you plan on a continuous expansion, I would get a pump that can handle it.

I think you would be happier with a vac and releaser. If you got a cheaper new vac and used releaser, you could save a little cash and put it into the woods. More mainlines, shorter laterals and few taps per lateral. Estimate about 5-7$ per tap to install the tubing. at $5, $1000 will get you 200 taps.

[Starting Small]

The $5-$7 per tap, does that include saddles, wire, taps, etc? Basically everything but the pump and releaser? Thanks,
-Dave

[Thad Blaisdell]

There may be an easier method...good old fashioned heat tape on a length of threaded copper tubing on the mains just before it enters the pump with a screen on the at the pump. Over size the tubing and you have a small balance tank built in. The screen will stop any ice that could damage the diaphragm and the heat tape will warm the sap to melt the ice. Most tapes run if the temp gets down to 35, some good ones have an adjustable temp. You could also insulate the tubing to make it more efficient with pipe insulation at HD. I would use the fiber glass product as it wont melt if the tape gets toasty. Hydrometer is a must!

The screen sounds like a good Idea in theory, but would not recommend. with vacuum you can get ice chunks moving at a pretty good clip. that screen would not make it.

[madmapler]

I'm surprised nobody has suggested going with a gast pump and bender releaser yet. Its a good way to get 23" to 25"of vacuum for cheap money and theres no freeze issues although what Breezy suggested seems like it might work. I did this set up last year and pulled 25" on about 100 taps It was my first year and my lines were pretty rough. A gast 2565,2567,2065 or 2067, can get 25". A 1550 can get 20"or better and they're all over ebay for cheap($100 or so). If you keep looking you can get one of the bigger pumps for around $200 to $250. Theres a bender on there right now for $200 but I think theres a bigger one in the classifieds on this site. If you're going to get over 300 taps or so you might want to step up to a bigger bender. The smaller one will support up to 200 but will be pretty busy on a real good run. (I have a gast 2065 and a smaller bender I can sell for $460 together or $230 a piece (Thats just what I paid). I'm just over the line from Mass and I could show you how to put it all together with a home made moisture trap if you're interested.)

[unc23win]

The $5-$7 per tap, does that include saddles, wire, taps, etc? Basically everything but the pump and releaser? Thanks,
-Dave

Yea $5-$7 per tap for everything but the pump and releaser. So if you went the guzzler route for this year how many taps would you do @ 20". It maxes at about 500. With 500 you could get 150-200 of syrup that should make a bigger pump and releaser and more taps very doable for next season. Just my thoughts used pumps are um well used pumps you never know if you go the used pump route have a spare.

[madmapler]

Just my thoughts used pumps are um well used pumps you never know if you go the used pump route have a spare. Used pumps are bought and sold every day. I have bought several and aside from replacing the vanes in one($65 and my fault for overspeeding it)they all work fine. I'm just moving on to larger equipment. Sure you may have one fail but for 1/5th the cost they're worth repairing if need be and repairs are generally simple. A spare wont break the bank either if you go that route. Rotary vane pumps like the gast are also known to be one of the most forgiving vacuum pumps available. A small leak or two may even go unnoticed. A guzzler on the other hand is an investment that could fail you the day you buy it if it gets ice or some other foreign debris in it. I doubt it'll do 20" at 500 taps on the tightest of systems with constant maintenance. Especially on a high flow day.The best diaphragm pumps are sold by Glenn Goodrich but cost considerably more than $500. So for the same money (or less) you can get higher vacuum, more sap, hence more syrup. My thoughts about setting up a tubing system is to get all you can out of it because your going to be investing a lot no matter. I'm not saying all this so I can sell my pump. Its just the way that I did it and I have no regrets.

[BreezyHill]

Spare pumps even with a new pump is a good investment. Who as ever had a new what ever last for two years. I had a new tractor trailer slide and axle shaft out off the hub after 1500 miles. It was just some loose bolts; but it happens. And to have a pump go down will only happen on the best day of the season. That's why we maintain the pumps and fire them up every 8 weeks and run the drippers wide open. Condensation eats these things alive. The used pump has usually sat for a stretch and is in need of some TLC( tender loving care) dint give it a little before you start the season and you are gambling on a lot of TLC(torment-looses-crying)
I picked up two pumps yesterday, One has sat for about 40 years and the other for 25. They will both get opened up, cleaned, new bearings, inspected, lubed, and tested. They will make great pumps unless they fail the testing. If they fail they will be parts units. The 40 year one was a little stiff but spun free after a shot of wonder fluid. She will be a dynamo.

Life is all about chances...if we fail to take chances we would never get out of bed in the morning.

You cant win the lottery if you never buy a ticket!

[unc23win]

Used pumps are bought and sold every day. I have bought several and aside from replacing the vanes in one($65 and my fault for overspeeding it)they all work fine. I'm just moving on to larger equipment. Sure you may have one fail but for 1/5th the cost they're worth repairing if need be and repairs are generally simple. A spare wont break the bank either if you go that route. Rotary vane pumps like the gast are also known to be one of the most forgiving vacuum pumps available. A small leak or two may even go unnoticed. A guzzler on the other hand is an investment that could fail you the day you buy it if it gets ice or some other foreign debris in it. I doubt it'll do 20" at 500 taps on the tightest of systems with constant maintenance. Especially on a high flow day.The best diaphragm pumps are sold by Glenn Goodrich but cost considerably more than $500. So for the same money (or less) you can get higher vacuum, more sap, hence more syrup. My thoughts about setting up a tubing system is to get all you can out of it because your going to be investing a lot no matter. I'm not saying all this so I can sell my pump. Its just the way that I did it and I have no regrets.

I wasn't dumping on used pumps just saying you never know. Yes for some parts are easy to find and others are bullet proof. I have 3 used pumps 1 Surge Sp-11 runs like a champ all do is put oil in the other 2 1 Kinney has issues and 1 Delaval needs vanes. A back up is a good idea new or used. As far as Gast I bought a brand new one on Ebay its oil less and made for industry and made to run continuosly day in day out. I think that once you get up there in taps it makes more sense to go new as you will need more CFMs a pump failing on 5,000 taps is a little bit more of big deal than one failing on 500. None the less the orignal poster is starting small and used may work out great.