Granulated sugar

[Mark]

What type of equipment do the larger producers use to make granulated sugar? I would like to convert a few hundred gallons of syrup into sugar but don't want to take a year to do it.

[spud]

The dealers all sell machines to make sugar. I think there is two sizes you can buy. I always had an interest in making sugar but not sure if I could ever sell enough to cover the cost of the machine.

Spud

[Moser's Maple]

many of the larger guys use a steam kettle to boil the syrup down, because it is way more efficient than boiling on your stove, and then use a commercial mixer like a Hobart.
we make roughly 500 lbs of sugar a year and I'll either boil a gallon down on the stove or use a small steam kettle my wife found (15 qt) and do a 2 gallon batch on our turn table cream machine.

[Mark]

many of the larger guys use a steam kettle to boil the syrup down, because it is way more efficient than boiling on your stove, and then use a commercial mixer like a Hobart.
we make roughly 500 lbs of sugar a year and I'll either boil a gallon down on the stove or use a small steam kettle my wife found (15 qt) and do a 2 gallon batch on our turn table cream machine.
Thanks, that is what I would have guessed. I have seen a sugar machine in a catalog and I would guess that was for screening the sugar. I will have to watch ebay.

How well does the sugar sell compared to the syrup?

[wiam]

I move more sugar in cotton candy than as sugar. Probably under 50 lbs/ year

[Moser's Maple]

as a rule of thumb, I believe syrup sells better than sugar, but our main marketing strategy is confections. so most of our syrup goes into some sort of confection. we have a good retail market for sugar....roughly 150 lbs go into cotton mix, another 200 lbs goes to resturants for a sweetner, or we give them the formula to add water and heat sugar back into syrup so they can have natural maple syrup without using valuable cooler space. the other 150 lbs goes to general sales, samples, and home usage for our families. what we like with the confections is instead of getting the standard 40-45/gallon for our area we are getting 70-80/gallon. now we do have to sit on the syrup throughout the year, we don't get the instant payment like selling in bulk, but by willing to hold it through the year we are double our money for our syrup.

[vikingHB]

many of the larger guys use a steam kettle to boil the syrup down, because it is way more efficient than boiling on your stove, and then use a commercial mixer like a Hobart.
we make roughly 500 lbs of sugar a year and I'll either boil a gallon down on the stove or use a small steam kettle my wife found (15 qt) and do a 2 gallon batch on our turn table cream machine.

Just wondering if you are also putting the sugar into molds. I always wondered how producers could make such a big batch (1/2 gallon +)for molds without it hardening before it is poured into all the molds. Usually start stirring at about 210 degrees, but probably stirring too long. Wait until the color starts changing, then start pouring in a hurry. I have reheated in microwave, but I just think it makes the sugar more dry, and hard.
Any tips?

[Amber Gold]

In the past, we've made say 50 lbs of granulated sugar and have been able to sell it. Now that we're larger, we have more syrup to make sugar from. I set aside enough syrup to make ~200 lbs of sugar. The 5 qt kitchen aid mixer will do it, but it doesn't like it, so once the mixer burnt out, I'm looking for an alternative and was going to post the same thread. I'd like to stick with the mixer, but we can use it for other things in the kitchen.

Does the 6qt kitchen aid mixer have enough juice to make say 1 gal batches of sugar? Looking for a countertop model.

We find that after we mix the sugar in the mixer, we spread it out on baking sheets to cool, then have to run it through the food processor to break up the clumps. Is this typical? Other methods?

[vikingHB]

In the past, we've made say 50 lbs of granulated sugar and have been able to sell it. Now that we're larger, we have more syrup to make sugar from. I set aside enough syrup to make ~200 lbs of sugar. The 5 qt kitchen aid mixer will do it, but it doesn't like it, so once the mixer burnt out, I'm looking for an alternative and was going to post the same thread. I'd like to stick with the mixer, but we can use it for other things in the kitchen.

Does the 6qt kitchen aid mixer have enough juice to make say 1 gal batches of sugar? Looking for a countertop model.

We find that after we mix the sugar in the mixer, we spread it out on baking sheets to cool, then have to run it through the food processor to break up the clumps. Is this typical? Other methods?

How do you package the granular sugar?
Seems like a popular format with consumers. Never have tried to sell it before, but seems like it might be time to start.
Also if you don't mind my asking how much would folks sell it for?

[red maples]

Just wondering if you are also putting the sugar into molds. I always wondered how producers could make such a big batch (1/2 gallon +)for molds without it hardening before it is poured into all the molds. Usually start stirring at about 210 degrees, but probably stirring too long. Wait until the color starts changing, then start pouring in a hurry. I have reheated in microwave, but I just think it makes the sugar more dry, and hard.
Any tips?

with a candy machine they say you can make up to 15-18lbs of candy per batch. it only stirs a small amount at a time. and the rest stays in the "PIG" (syrup pan) as it comes out of the spigot more feeds into the trough.

as for small batches I do a quart + at a time. keep several pyrex glass measuring cups clean and warm hold the pot of syrup at 200+ degrees the best you can. try not to add more syrup to the original cup once that it done scrape it and move onto a clean cup you will get more consistant candy without getting too grainy or too dry and less white spots.

[Dave Y]

To make granulated sugar, syrup should be heated to 260degs. I use a paddle cream machine. It makes nice sugar. CDL make a sugar machine. It also makes nice sugar, but you would have to make plenty of sugar to pay for it.

[wiam]

with a candy machine they say you can make up to 15-18lbs of candy per batch. it only stirs a small amount at a time. and the rest stays in the "PIG" (syrup pan) as it comes out of the spigot more feeds into the trough.

as for small batches I do a quart + at a time. keep several pyrex glass measuring cups clean and warm hold the pot of syrup at 200+ degrees the best you can. try not to add more syrup to the original cup once that it done scrape it and move onto a clean cup you will get more consistant candy without getting too grainy or too dry and less white spots.

This thread is getting confusing with candy in the middle of a sugar thread

[wiam]

In the past, we've made say 50 lbs of granulated sugar and have been able to sell it. Now that we're larger, we have more syrup to make sugar from. I set aside enough syrup to make ~200 lbs of sugar. The 5 qt kitchen aid mixer will do it, but it doesn't like it, so once the mixer burnt out, I'm looking for an alternative and was going to post the same thread. I'd like to stick with the mixer, but we can use it for other things in the kitchen.

Does the 6qt kitchen aid mixer have enough juice to make say 1 gal batches of sugar? Looking for a countertop model.

We find that after we mix the sugar in the mixer, we spread it out on baking sheets to cool, then have to run it through the food processor to break up the clumps. Is this typical? Other methods?

I have a homemade paddle machine. The pan is the bottom of a 40 gallon stainless drum about 7" high. I cook it in the pan. I can make about 22 lbs per batch. I have found that I get less big chunks if I screen it when it is still warm. I use a strainer I got at Wallyworld made to hang in a sink, approximately 8"X12"

[lew]

Amber Gold,

Push your sugar through a screen while it is still warm. You should be able to get 100% through the screen with no chunks left over. We heat our syrup to 254 for the first batch then play with the temp. from there. Maybe a 1/2 degree higher or lower depending on how it acts going through the screen. If the temp. is too high it will act dry and harden up too fast and won't go through the screen easily. If the temp. is too low it takes a long time to granulate.

[Scribner's Mountain Maple]

I was wondering the best grade syrup to use for sugar. I have made a small batch to make blackberry jam, but would like to create a new product for my retail customers.

[red maples]

This thread is getting confusing with candy in the middle of a sugar thread

Sorry, but you are right, just answering a question.

[wiam]

I was wondering the best grade syrup to use for sugar. I have made a small batch to make blackberry jam, but would like to create a new product for my retail customers.

I prefer darker. Last year I made some really good flavor C that went into sugar. It is also neat to make a value added product from "commercial" syrup. Flavor of sugar is better from dark and it gives cotton candy more "maple" and color.

[Moser's Maple]

I agree with wiam... we don't use commercial but our dark amber goes in to sugar....gives the best maple flavor....we do some sugar with medium if request for a less in your face maple taste.

[Dave Y]

I use light and medium syrup for sugar and confections. I feel it has a more pleasing flavor and a much better appearance than the darker grades.

[Moser's Maple]

Dave you are correct also for regular confections like cream and sugar candy (molded maple sugar) we use only light amber and a light medium. the appearance is nicer and because when you boil down the syrup the sweetness is multiplied we use the more delicate tasting syrups. for granulated sugar and lolli pops we use a darker syrup to give it a better maple flavor
seems to me people are confusing or randomly jumping back and forth between granulated sugar and maple confections. I thought this thread was about granulated sugar????

[Amber Gold]

We use the darkest syrup we make before it gets an off flavor...darker syrup more flavor. This year, we made a lot of it, so I have the potential to make/sell a lot of sugar.

Thanks Lew. I'll make another batch this weekend and try running it through the sieve while it's still hot. What do you do w/ it once it's through the sieve? Leave it on a baking sheet (or something) to cool?

What's the going rate? We're selling 4 oz shakers for $6 and 8 oz. for $10. What about 1lb bags, or maybe even larger quantities? How are you marketing it to restaurants?

[red maples]

thanks for the pricing I am gonna make some shortly and just bought some shakers. I have some good flavor commercial that I am gonna use. I like light syrup for candy, dark syrup for cream and I would think it really depends on the use for the granulated sugar would determine what grade would be best to use. for example if you use a light or light medium grade it wwould be good for sweetening things that you really don't want a lot of maple flavor like a tea or coffee maybe or using in maybe a pastry of some sort. but if your looking to really boost the flavor and get a bigger maple in something then the darker would be better to use. in something like oatmeal or something like that.

just thinking from a customer point of view.

[GeneralStark]

One thing to consider when making granulated sugar from darker syrup is high invert sugar levels. Cornell's manual suggests using syrup with 2% or less invert as above that you may experience batches that don't consistently crystallize well. I ran into this a bit last season with some dark syrup that was made during the summer of march and had over 8% invert.

I generally blend syrups to make sugar and other confections and for sugar shoot for around 1.5 - 2%. The lighter syrups crystallize well and the darker syrup boosts the flavor. I generally follow this rule but shoot for different invert levels in all the confections I make and I get lots of comments from my customers about the excellent maple flavor in my products.

I am going to experiment with some late season, prebud syrup and try to make sugar with it. I have heard that boiling this type of syrup to 265 will volatilize the organic compounds that provide the off flavor, thus removing them. Theoretically there should be no off flavor in the sugar. I know large packers do this, but I also know they blend as well.

I have been having good luck with a paddle style cream machine that I have two pans for. I boil in one pan and then spin the other. This way I can do multiple batches with ease. I rent a commercial kitchen space, so I often have more than one thing going at once. I heat the syrup, spin the pan, sift, and then let dry in stainless steel kitchen pans that I also use for cooling cooked syrup for making cream. I do end up with some crumble which I also package and sell. I have many customers that like the coarse sugar bits for sweetening or baking.

I have been packaging granulated sugar in mason jars, .5 pint (1/3 lb), pint(2/3 lb), and quart (1+1/3lb.). These are priced at 6$, 11$, and 15$ respectively. I have seen granulated maple sugar in the local co-ops for 16$/lb. I do also sell it in bags for shipping and I have a few wholesale accounts that buy small quantities for 9$/lb.

I'm not sure the sugar yields a great deal more profit than selling syrup, but it does add one more product that is unique and people find very interesting. Many of my sugar sales at the market are to people that are just curious about it. In a region where everyone and their brother is or knows a sugarmaker it really helps to have other maple products available for customers. At the market I do there can be anywhere from 1-4 other people selling syrup but noone else has other maple products, so it has been a major help for my profits to have these other products. Yesterday at market, the one other guy selling syrup sold none, but I sold lots of cream, candy and sugar and some syrup. I also think customers prefer buying from a true "maple producer" as it shows that you know what you are doing when you can make all these other fabulous products.

[Dave Y]

While I may have mentioned confections I am also referring to granulated sugar. I have seen sugar made from darker syrup and personally I would not buy it. In my opinion it looks to gray. When adding maple sugar to a recipe, the maple flavor should not over power the other flavors ,it should compliment them.

[Amber Gold]

We use the syrup between retail and commercial grade...before the off-flavor gets real bad. We find the little off-flavor there does burn off and makes a good flavored sugar with a dark brown color like brown sugar. We heat to 260F and haven't had any issue w/ it crystallizing.

Cream machine to make sugar...interesting. I like using the candy machine to make cream though...pour it directly into the container.

I haven't tried making cream from dark amber...I'll give it a shot. 50% of our crop this year was dark amber, so we have plenty of it. We made taffy from DA and thought it was too much. Lollipops made from DA taste real good though.

[Moser's Maple]

our marketing strategy to restaurants was actually pretty easy. we have a couple contact us about syrup, then they found out we made granulated sugar and want to us that as a sweetener in some dishes, then I just mentioned that you can make syrup from sugar, and that how it started. I took some of our sugar showed the chef how much water to add and popped it in the microwave and bang you had your syrup for breakfast dishes and the sunday buffet. it works out great cause we get a little more per gallon of syrup and they get more cooler room for other things besides syrup.

[lew]

Amber Gold

After pusing it through the screen, we let it cool then weigh it up and package. If you package it warm, you get condensation in the packagaing.

[Moser's Maple]

Here is a video I made to help out the first time sugar maker, a producer that's wants to try their hand at making sugar, or the buyer that's wants something else to do with their syrup. Hope this helps others out.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m9F3vyHr-1U

[MN Jake]

Here is a video I made to help out the first time sugar maker, a producer that's wants to try their hand at making sugar, or the buyer that's wants something else to do with their syrup. Hope this helps others out.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m9F3vyHr-1U
That's great, I will be trying that for sure. Thanks for showing!

[lpakiz]

Hey jake,
Now that's an instructional video anyone can follow, from start to finish! You make it seem so easy.
Thanks for posting this. I'm gonna try it for sure. When making granulated sugar, will any syrup work-dark, light, early, late? Is it only for candy and cream that the invert becomes important?

[jmayerl]

I have used light and dark, just need to adjust the temp accordingly.
Stirring by hand......that's what his invented machines for !

[Jonnyp390]

Jake, awesome video! Thanks for sharing. I have a day off from work and some leftover dark syrup from last year, so I think I am going to give it a try.

[Moser's Maple]

thanks!!! I hope it helps

[SDdave]

That is a great instructional video!! Thank you for posting it.

SDdave

[wilson maple]

I've just started making some granulated maple sugar last week for the first time. I started with a half gallon of dark amber and when I was all done I ended up with just over 3 pounds of sugar. I was wondering if this was about the normal return of sugar from that amount of syrup or should I have yielded more?

[Moser's Maple]

I've just started making some granulated maple sugar last week for the first time. I started with a half gallon of dark amber and when I was all done I ended up with just over 3 pounds of sugar. I was wondering if this was about the normal return of sugar from that amount of syrup or should I have yielded more?
yes that sounds about right because you have shrinkage when you boil down that syrup

[KevinS]

yes that sounds about right because you have shrinkage when you boil down that syrup
You loose water.. you should not be losing sugar, and a gallon of syrup is supposed to have 11 pounds of sugar.
correct?

[SWEETER CREATIONS]

you should end up with about 7 1/2 pounds of sugar. Your right syrup weighs 11 pounds but has 32 to 34 % water so you boil the water off and end up with 7 1/2 pounds .

[Moser's Maple]

You loose water.. you should not be losing sugar, and a gallon of syrup is supposed to have 11 pounds of sugar.
correct?


you should end up with about 7 1/2 pounds of sugar. Your right syrup weighs 11 pounds but has 32 to 34 % water so you boil the water off and end up with 7 1/2 pounds .
sweeter is right..... now get this when making cream people end up with 8 lbs/gallon commonly because once again you're not boiling the water off as much.....i suppose your amount of sugar you yield could also vary depending on what temp you boil to, and what your brix is in your syrup. it may be small, but you'll yield more confection from a gallon of 67 brix syrup vs a gallon of 66 brix syrup....just for the simple fact that there is more sugar in the heavier syrup

[NW Ohio]

I've just started making some granulated maple sugar last week for the first time. I started with a half gallon of dark amber and when I was all done I ended up with just over 3 pounds of sugar. I was wondering if this was about the normal return of sugar from that amount of syrup or should I have yielded more?

Just to be clear, at 67 Brix a half gallon of syrup should yield about 3.75 lbs. of sugar. About 7.5 lbs. from a full gallon as others have said. So it sounds like you did pretty good. We just did a half gallon and it yielded just over 3.5 lbs. not including what stuck to the pan and spoon.

[Sugarmaker]

Thread is back on track, As usuall Jake has done a good job helping folks. Thanks!
Yes the 7.5 lb of granulated is about right for a yield from a gallon of syrup. Remember as noted that some of the late season syrup may not crystalize as well. Earlier light or medium syrup may work best. As far as machines to make it. Hands down the big Hobart mixer is the way to go! We can make a gallon to gallon and a half in one batch, and when done we still have arms:)
Good thread!
We sell 20-30 lbs per year. It doesn't move as well as syrup of some of our other confections. But we have a recipe we put on the bags for folks to make a light dip for fruit. Good stuff!
Also on pricing I think most of the confections should bring a dollar per oz. or more.
Regards,
Chris

[us314395]

I have tried twice now, to make granulated sugar from Dark Syrup. I tried 260 degrees and 275 degrees and just cannot get it to crystallize. I stirred and stirred with a kitchen aid mixer. All I was able to get was a hard taffy (260 degrees) and hard candy (275 degrees). I speculate that invert sugars are my problem. Any suggestions on how I can get this stuff to crystallize? Higher Temp? Let cool farther before stirring? Other? Thanks.

[WESTMAPLES]

yeah I made sugar out of the batch of what was supposed to be candy last nite I took it kinda far and I thought well never a better time to make some nice sugar and it came out great. i don't know what the yield was as it was supposed to be candy but its taste great in my coffee.

[Moser's Maple]

I have tried twice now, to make granulated sugar from Dark Syrup. I tried 260 degrees and 275 degrees and just cannot get it to crystallize. I stirred and stirred with a kitchen aid mixer. All I was able to get was a hard taffy (260 degrees) and hard candy (275 degrees). I speculate that invert sugars are my problem. Any suggestions on how I can get this stuff to crystallize? Higher Temp? Let cool farther before stirring? Other? Thanks.
when you say dark syrup do you mean dark amber.....or are you talking grade B?

[us314395]

My assumption is that it is grade B.

[Moser's Maple]

then probably yes.....your inverts are probably too high to make confections with.....if you don't mind possibly loosing more syrup you might be able to raise the temp to 285-290....but now you are starting to flirt with temps that lollipops are made at, plus the higher you go the greater the possibility of burning the syrup

[us314395]

Thanks. I will give that a try. I have about 10 gallons of grade B leftover from last year.