moldy syrup

[markcasper]

I'm sure everyone has had a jar or two of syrup mold. It seems here in Wisconsin that there is more syrup packed and sold in glass than in the eastern states.

I have never put syrup in a gallon plastic jug yet. I usually sell the gallons in glass and actually use alot of returned gallon glass that I get from the local food co-op where I sell them syrup. I am sure everyone remembers all of the glass that apple juice used to come in not too long ago. The food coop will not buy syrup in plastic, in fact, all of the organic apple juice that they sell is all in glass.

I had several cases of the 3 and 8 ounce glass leaf bottles left over from last year. I was going through them last night and discovered that nearly half of them had molded. All of the syrup gets packed between 185 and 200 with the cap put on immediately. I have had this happen in other years, but not as bad as this time. Very rarley did any of my pints through gallons have any mold on them, even after a year in the bottle. I also have had trouble with 1/2 pint glass getting mold on the top. Does anyone else seem to have these problems with the maple leaf bottles? Some are hard to detect the presence of mold, but open it up and the inside of the cap has dark spots :cry:

My solution is going to be to cut back on how many of these I fill and the ones that I do fill are going to go to the freezer asap.

I did have problems a few years back on the quarts and pints. The dealers seem to play puzzle games with what kinds of lids they have on hand. One time I got all of these plastic caps with a foam and/or cardboard liner. They are and were CRAP!!! I had case after case get moldy. The following year they went back to the white metal lid with a compound around the inside of the lid. These are the best and as one dealer said "foolproof" in keeping the syrup from molding. Mark

[maple flats]

I have only had a few go moldy over the years and always thought it was opperator error. Things like not inverting the bottle long enough, not maintaining correct temp etc. If the canner has any amount of syrup in the valve line and the temp is getting close to the 180 mark, what hits the bottle may not be 180+. The first draw too might do that too. For example on my canner I have a 1/2"x1.5 nipple, a ball valve, another 1/2x1.5 nipple and my foot operated valve with a heavy ss fitting dropping the syrup and this holds a lot of syrup if you are filling a small cold glass bottle unless you draw a qty and dump back into canner to heat up the works first. I have also suspected my daughter cans towards the end of a canner batch where temp can drop rappidly and looses track of the temp and does not turn heat on soon enough to bring back up to safe level.

[ibby458]

We had a lot of mold problems a few years back. Once we started rinsing the jugs with boiling water just before filling, the problem went away. Probably would be a pain with a larger operation, but we rarely canned more than 5 gallons at a time.

[maplehound]

I always heat my glass bottles in the oven before filling them. Set the oven at 200 deg. and keep them in there for several minutes before taking them right out and filling them. This has helped me alot. I had alot of moldy glass before I stared this.
Ron

[markcasper]

I have heard of this being done before, especially with the 1.7 ounce bottles. That may be some of my problem and I will maybe have to do the canning of these in the house. I do not have a stove in my sugar shack to preheat the bottles. The sales of maple leaf bottles really fell of last year for me. Anyone else experience this as well.

In 04, I sold well over 50 dozen 3.4 and 8.45 ounce containers. I maybe sold 13-14 dozen all of last year. I think the newness is gone and they are all over the place as every Joe in the neighborhood is filling them these days.

I think trying to get boiling water in the leaf jars would not work well.

As for laying containers on their side, does this really need to be done. All of my gallon and half gallons (glass) that have the lug caps on never get laid down and these lids always make a "pop" when the vacuum sucks it down. When you hear the pop, i no i am safe. Mark

[maple flats]

The pop only means you are vac sealed, it does not mean any thing on the underside of the cap is killed. Might get away with that on larger sizes because the temp would rise to fill the void in the form of vapor (steam?) but on smaller sizes you must lay container over. I have gotten best results doing so for 5 minutes min. but some say you only need a minute. I lay mine over as I continue to can and stand up after several are filled but I usually only stand the oldest several then fill again, next time I stand I again do the oldest and so on. I have never had mold on a large # but did have some on a few my adult daughter filled and I was not there to coach her, she had never filled before this year.

[brookledge]

If you have mold present in a sealed container it only means on thing.
The syrup was not hot enough to kill the spores present in the container. Definately with the small containers you have to be more carefull because as soon as the syrup goes into the container you lose the temp. imeaditely. The best thing is to increase your temp to around 200 so you have a little leway or pre heat your containers.
I pack all my syrup for retail in plastic except for a few special orders of glass leafs and a few other kinds and would rather use plastic any day.
I have never had a mold problem with hot packing in plastic or glass so if you are take another look at your process and see where your losing your temperature before you seal it.
Keith

[WESTVIRGINIAMAPLER]

I only pack in plastic and I couldn't give away glass around here and I alway bottle the syrup boiling. I have done this for years and it seems to work better than anything. :D

[maplehound]

Brandon,
If you were bottling in glass you wouldn't be bottling it boiling. That hot a temp would cause the sugar sand to reform and cloud the syrup. The key to bottling glass is to have crystal clear syrup.
ron

[mountainvan]

Every container I bottle, including 5 gal pails, I flip over or lay on the side until the container has cooled. Some of the pails have had a little mold but the retail containers never have. The hot syrup needs to be in contact with all surfaces to kill the spores.

[Flatfoot95]

I just discovered some mold on some 5 gallon pails I was getting ready to bottle. Anything I can do? Or is this a total loss.

[Fred Henderson]

Oh say, just skim it off and reheat the stuff to bottleing temp. On some jugs it tells you that you can do that. Anything with that much sugar in it will mold if it is not vacumn sealed.

[markcasper]

I have heard nothing yet about the different style caps and their ability to keep the air out. Has noone ever used the caps with the card board or foam liners?
I was in the supermarket tonight and noticed that there was a pint glass jar of syrup with mold on the top. This syrup is supplied by a packer/dealer who I do business with. He has a hundred thousand dollar set-up and yes.........mold on the top, and in the store!!

He does not use the caps with the compound on the inside I think because of cost. How come noone has mentioned anything about the caps and only raved about not getting the syrup hot enough?

Why is it that I rarely have a bottle with the compound lined caps mold, and yet the maple leaf bottles , as well as 1/2 pints with goofy plastic lid go bad? For those that say their syrup never goes bad in plastic, how can you know whether it does or not. I have opened up plastic before and found mold.

For the guy that had 5 gallon pails mold. Was the syrup from this year? If it was then the mold probably hasn't been there too long and the mold has just started. I would think it would be ok as long as you get it canned asap. And like others have said....be sure to check for an off flavor. Usually you can skim the top inch off and toss it, try not and mix it all in together, this will ruin the taste. Better yet, if you could some how draw the syrup from the bottom of the pail and then when there is an inch left, stop. Mark

[Flatfoot95]

Thanks for the suggestions. I think I will try and drain from the bottom some how like you suggested Mark. Will let you know how it comes out.

[markcasper]

flatfoot, you will have to read my post on the other thread. As long as the syrup was not outside in direct sunlight, then the mold should be minimal and maybe not worth wasting any by trying to get it off the bottom.

The reason I mention outside,,,,back in 03 I had a big year and actually had barrels outside on pallets that I filled. By the time I got to marketing it by the end of May, the tops of the barrels had a fermented smell. The buyer didn't seem to say anything. The barrels that were inside were just starting to mold, but they had no fermented smell. I learned from this, but never had to be in that spot since. I will move the syrup via loader tractor to the shop, until I do get it marketed, don't leave it outside where the barrels get warmed by the sun. Mark

[Maple Hill Sugarhouse]

What do you think will kill the mold spores on the cap after you put the lid on the container if you leave it standing up? Lay the container on it's side for a few minutes :idea:

[mountainvan]

any mold in any size container can be skimmed off, and it should not affect the flavor, grade, etc. of the syrup. sugar yeast will mess up the syrup, it's the only thing I know of that can live inside syrup at 66%. Both problems can be caused by not bottling at the right temp or more often, not getting the hot syrup to all the surfaces inside the container. fermented syrup will be grade c even it's light amber. moldy skim it, or re filter, heat it up and package it. as for the caps I don't think the style make a difference as long as the syrup is bottled correctly. everybody messes up every once in awhile.

[markcasper]

The year that I used the plastic caps with the foam/cardboard liner.................I was not the only one to have the same problem. When some were opened after 6 months in storage, the liner was not even with the top rim of the glass, it had caved in and there was a large gap between the liner and top of the cap....laying these on their side wouldn't have made any difference.

The dealer discontinued carrying these lids a year later...wonder why??

[Maple Hill Sugarhouse]

Another ? to ask yourself is=How full are you filling the containers to the top lip? --- 1/2" ???

[brookledge]

You should always use a pressure sensitive seal with plastic. You should be able to remove the cap and the seal should stay sealed.
If you where using cardboard then thats more than likely your problem.
Some larger containers have 2" pipe thread top just like a drum and as long as you have a good rubber gasket in the cap it will work fine.
Keith