Effects of a LONG winter vs short winter ??

[TerryEspo]

I am hoping to hear some type of good news from my question.

Since a few of us live in a more Northern climate than most people here, my winters are longer, my trees sleep longer, my darn snow is deeper.... etc.

Is there any reward for me and the sap that my trees give ? Does the sap in the roots freezing longer and/or colder affect my sugar content ?

I am looking for that "For every action there is an equal and opposite reaction".

I just want some sort of good news as to make me feel better, lol.

There must something, please, please, please.

I hope our "Oh So Helpful" Dr. Tim has some input on this !!

Thanks.

Terry

[DrTimPerkins]

Is there any reward for me and the sap that my trees give ? Does the sap in the roots freezing longer and/or colder affect my sugar content ?

Hi Terry,

Sorry to burst your bubble, but probably not. We are in the middle of a big study looking at various relationships among environmental (temperature, precipitation, drought) and biological (insects, disease, budbreak, seed production) and sap sugar concentration and sap yield. It is taking a long time just to construct the dataset, not to mention design and conduct the proper analysis, so far too early to start talking about results yet. Maybe later this year.

[Mike R.]

That is a very good question. I have always thought the more frost in the ground the better the season...might just be a tall tale.

[TerryEspo]

Hey Mike:

If Dr. Tim and the study doesn't provide us with any scientific good news, there is hope.

We can tap our trees 6 ft. high and only use a foot of tubing, when drilling high taps we dont need 6-8 ft step ladders-just reach up, we can keep our sap cool with all the snow around, used equipment (if needed) may be available from the Southerners who are done their season before we even tap.

I am sure there is more but they aren't as good as being able to tap NOW like so many others !!

Thanks Dr. Tim for the solid information, happy you saw the post and I never shoot the messenger, lol.

Thanks.

Terry

[JAMIE]

Terry,
I was up in my sugar bush today and some lateral lines i will have to step OVER them to tap.The snow in the bush in places is up to my waist.With all this snow i hope it lenghtens out are season as it may take a while for this snow to melt off.Keep your drill handy as one day soon it may even warm up enough to tap.I hope Mike is correct about the frost!Its tough waiting while we read about some of the others getting going.I guess its the price we pay for living up here!;)

[DrTimPerkins]

I have always thought the more frost in the ground the better the season...might just be a tall tale.

In most forest soils, there is typically not a lot of frost....especially if there is decent (6" or more) snow cover. In years when there is little snow, there may be some soil freezing. This is probably NOT particularly good. In order to collect the sap, the water must first move from the soil to the stem and branches. If the soil is frozen, then there is no water movement (most of the feeder roots are very shallow, 4-6" deep) upward, and thus less sap to come out. Similarly, if there is a lot of snow, and it is tightly packed around the stems, there can be no (or little) water movement through that area until it melts back (you know that little area where the snow away melts around the stem).

What is probably more important (giving away some of our results here) is soil moisture/precipitation in the late-spring. As long as there is good snow-pack to provide melt-water and/or you get decent rain/snow in the mid-late sugaring season, then you have a chance for a good sap yield. If it is too dry, sap yield is considerably lower.

[JAMIE]

Thanks Dr. Tim for the explanation.You explain things so well that even i can get a clear understanding thanks!cancel the frost! sound s like a nice slow melt off is what we need.

[Homestead Maple]

In most forest soils, there is typically not a lot of frost....especially if there is decent (6" or more) snow cover. In years when there is little snow, there may be some soil freezing. This is probably NOT particularly good. In order to collect the sap, the water must first move from the soil to the stem and branches. If the soil is frozen, then there is no water movement (most of the feeder roots are very shallow, 4-6" deep) upward, and thus less sap to come out. Similarly, if there is a lot of snow, and it is tightly packed around the stems, there can be no (or little) water movement through that area until it melts back (you know that little area where the snow away melts around the stem).

What is probably more important (giving away some of our results here) is soil moisture/precipitation in the late-spring. As long as there is good snow-pack to provide melt-water and/or you get decent rain/snow in the mid-late sugaring season, then you have a chance for a good sap yield. If it is too dry, sap yield is considerably lower.

I was wondering what there is about constant temps below freezing for the winter and what it might have to do with the sap in maples? It seems that those that have tapped and made some syrup already, they have made light amber syrup, where as the past few winters where the temps during the winter have been moderate, we start by making medium and in some instances even dark syrup to start the season. Even though we may not like sub zero weather in the winter, it seems that it is beneficial for the trees?

[DrTimPerkins]

Even though we may not like sub zero weather in the winter, it seems that it is beneficial for the trees?

Anything below freezing is fine. Temperatures need not fall to sub-zero. The trees aren't really affected either way and there is no substantial effect on sap chemistry, EXCEPT that during brief thaws, there is some replenishment of sap in the trees via uptake of soil water. That is actually good, as it has some relationship to metabolism off-flavor. Cold winters without thaw seem to hold the fall amino acids produced about that time in the stem. If they aren't diluted or flushed out, it appears that they can cause metabolism off-flavor in the early spring. If we get a few thaws.....much less metabolism.

It is predominantly the microorganisms in sap, the sugar content, and the speed of processing (heating) that affect the color of syrup.

[Homestead Maple]

One other question Dr. Tim, sometimes during the middle of a sugar season or so, there will sometimes be a cold temp period come in where the temps will be so cold that sap will not flow for a week or two. It seems that after this cold spell the grade color of syrup will be lighter. Meaning that if dark syrup is being made before this cold spell, afterwards, medium syrup will be made for a few days and then back to dark or the same for other grade colors. What causes that, less microorganisms?

[DrTimPerkins]

What causes that, less microorganisms?

Exactly. The cold weather has knocked back the population of microorganisms in the lines, so the invert sugar level goes down in the sap. The cold also induces the conversion of starch to sugar, so the sap sugar content might go up a little bit.