How deep for 5/16" spouts?

[jimmol]

How deep do I drill the taphole?
How deep do I insert the spout? (with the slight taper maybe I should ask what drip bit size do most use so it will stop a the taper)

Decided to change to 5/16 spouts this year and the one that sits in front of me has a 1 1/2" shaft before the 5/8" head where the spout turns downward where the tubing will take the sap to the 5 gallon bucket. The part that goes into the tree has 3/8" long taper that ends about 7/8" up the shaft. In the online world it says the taphole can be a short as 1 1/2 to 3" deep. Various posts and online publications have shown that 1 1/2" tapholes yield nearly as much as those 2 1/2" deep.
Since I have not used these before I defer to those who use them to guide me as I start. So if you would be so kind as to help me out I would appreciate it.

Thanks much

Oh, what are the CV adapters I read about in some posts?

[red maples]

first I use a 5/16 drill bit

second I Drill holes about 1-1/2 to 1-3/4" from the outer edge of the bark on normal size trees. normal being lower limit size trees. when you get a monster maple the bark can be as much as an inch thick or more so I usually add on an extra 1/2 to 3/4 inch on those. so basically 1-1/4 to 1-1/2 into solid wood.

as far as how far the tap goes in....when its seated. several light taps until you hear the sound change to a thunk. it will go tap tap tap tap ...thunk....remember light taps. usually don't go in very far. its really not important how far it goes in as long as its seated in the hole.

CV's or check valve spouts, there are now 2 types, both have a little ball in them and they are designed mainly for vacuum systems, when there is back pressure in the lines from releaser dumping or what ever it closes off and doesn't allow the sap from the mainline back into the tap hole. The main line has basically bacteria in it to contaminate the tap hole and microbes will close off the tap hole and you get less sap. the 2 type (both made by leader) one is the adapter which you need a standard stubby spout. the other is a one piece clear plastic spout. Depending on your set up if you don't use vaccuum your best best is to use the clear plastic seasonal spouts you will reduce you amount of microbes "infecting" the tap hole and produce sap for a longer period of time and extentend your season. theses tap you throw out at the end of the season and use new every year.

I think thats it.

[Jeff E]

The only thing I would add regarding this is that the farther in the tap goes, the more sap wood is covered, or sealed off so sap wont flow out of it. Basically you want to drill the hole as straight and clean as possible, and then just seat the tap so it seals with the wood, leaving as much sap wood open as possible.

[adk1]

The only thing I would add regarding this is that the farther in the tap goes, the more sap would is covered, or sealed off so sap wont flow out of it. Basically you want to drill the hole as straight and clean as possible, and then just seat the tap so it seals with the wood, leaving as much sap wood open as possible.

Interesting, I just go till I hear the thunk no matter what. I also set by stopper on my drill bit (piece of 5/16" tubing) to 2" so I drill in the tree 2". Probably with the bark you are talking 1.75" on a normal tree. On a large tree with allot of bark, Iwill actually peel off a section of the bark that Iwant to tap or I will try to tap in between the bark where it isnt as thick.
On gravity, the farther you tap into the wood the more sap up to about 3" I believe. On vac, it doesnt really matter as much. 2" is a pretty good overall depth ration between tree health and you getting sap. I do not really know how far the tap goes into the tree once I hear the "thud". I will have to measure that this year and figure out how much area there is between the end of my tap and the end of the hole.

[Jeff E]

I use a stopper, or guide as well. I slip a piece of 5/16 tubing over the drill bit, leaving 2 1/4 in of bit exposed.
On smaller trees, I tell guys who are helping me to stop at 1 1/2 to 2 inches. On big trees with thicker bark, go full depth.

I tell them the main thing is tapping white wood. Find the area that has no damage, is rounded and showing signs of growth, and tap.

Then we use the sound indicator as well. That tap tap thunk indicates the spout is seated. If you swing to hard, that does not happen until the spout is way in there. I have had guys helping me taking full swings with a framing hammer, and they say it never seated. Drove the tap in all the way, split the tree for 2 ft above and below the hole! Oh well. We all learn at differently. No more army of guys tapping for me, just of few trusted guys, taking there time, doing it right.

I agree, on gravity a deeper hole works better, on vac, not as critical.

[jimmol]

Thanks for the CV info, I am now informed though I will have a gravity system.

Moving from a 7/16 to the 5/16 had me concerned that I might not get as much sap flow from my 8 tree but from what most have said in other posts I will be close to getting the same amount.

Thanks for the information and tips. A few more weeks and I can start tapping.

[adk1]

Thanks for the CV info, I am now informed though I will have a gravity system.

Moving from a 7/16 to the 5/16 had me concerned that I might not get as much sap flow from my 8 tree but from what most have said in other posts I will be close to getting the same amount.

Thanks for the information and tips. A few more weeks and I can start tapping.

It is true that you will get less, but its still better for the tree. You can use CV's on gravity. I do.

[red maples]

Its a little less but its really marginal in the diffence. Deff. go with the 5/16th much better for the tree. you could even do the 19/64 I think they are they are a seasonal spout too. but the 5/16 is the way to go in my opinion

[adk1]

Its a little less but its really marginal in the diffence. Deff. go with the 5/16th much better for the tree. you could even do the 19/64 I think they are they are a seasonal spout too. but the 5/16 is the way to go in my opinion

Put it this way, in my opinion, anyone using 7/16" spout is a fool. Yeah, I said it. AS Dr. Tim said during a presentation at the Verona Conference on tapping sustainability, the introduction of the 5/16" spout has probably been the greatest asset to tree health etc..THe PMRC is working on an interactive tapping sustainability chart that you can input variables into. ITs amazing the difference in the amount of negetative impact that the 7/16" spout has on a tree compared to the 5/16".