Wes Fab Filter Press - plugged??

[Lazarus]

Hi everyone,

I bought a Wes Fab short bank gear-driven pump a week ago. Ran about 30 gallons of syrup through it yesterday with no problems. I cleaned it out and replaced the papers about every 5 gallons. Ran hot water through it and cleaned it all up last night.

This morning I set it up again, and it will only run about a quart of syrup through it before it completely explodes. The last stage of the filter (closest to the pump) seems to blow first, seeping syrup, quickly followed by the rest. The pressure skyrockets and pegs after about 5 seconds. I have cleaned it out now twice and it will run hot water, but not syrup. My syrup temp is 195-200 degrees, with about a two cups of DE per 5 gallon. All the plates are aligned. I'm not doing anything differently than I was yesterday.

I can't see anything wrong with it, and I'm out of ideas. Also tired of cleaning up syrup off everything and I don't want to break this thing - any thoughts?

Thanks,
-Laz


225 taps in 2012
2 x 6 GBM
New sugar shack planned this year

[OldManMaple]

I'm sure you had the holes in the paper in the right spot. Also did you wet your papers first?

[Lazarus]

Yes, checked the holes on both occasions I tried it today and everything was lined up perfectly.

I didn't wet the papers first, but I didn't yesterday either and it was fine.

I've now run about 5 gallons of water through the press with fresh papers, and 5 gallons through the bypass. I'm not getting any pressure above 5 psi. I'll try the syrup once more.

[OldManMaple]

We had the same trouble with ours last year. Made some trouble shooting calls and no one mentioned wetting the papers. Read it here on the trader and it makes all the difference. I should have known as we always wet our flat filters. Recirculate the syrup back in to the unfiltered syrup until it runs clear and use the bypass to keep the pressure down once the press starts to gets plugged up. You can squeeze the last of the syrup through that way.

[Lazarus]

Well, I just tried that, and it didn't work. Wet the papers and all. The pressure spikes pretty much instantly, and I mean like completely pegged. I basically have to open the bypass about halfway to keep the pressure below 75, and I'm getting barely any filtered syrup. It's all going into the bypass. If I apply any more pressure it starts to the blow.

[OldManMaple]

I was so frustrated last year I almost went back to my flat filters. Maybe some one else can help. Strange it's not getting any further than the first plate. The gremlins have been messing with me too.

[Lazarus]

Well, I'm pretty sure it's getting past all the plates, as I do get some out, typically a few cups before it totally pegs, which is about 2 seconds' worth on this thing. All of the plates have DE in them, so I know it's getting through the entire machine. It did not do this at all yesterday. I ran about 5 passes of 5 gallons each flaswlessly without even getting near 50 psi. The sixth pass was a particularly "dirty" c-grade, and I only got 2 gallons through it before it started to get plugged. I assumed it was the syrup, but I think maybe that was when the problem was starting.

I really hope if I can't figure it out, the dealer will take it back. It was a very expensive machine to only get a day's worth of use out of.

[markcasper]

The sixth pass was a particularly "dirty" c-grade, and I only got 2 gallons through it before it started to get plugged. I assumed it was the syrup, but I think maybe that was when the problem was starting.

.
You solved your problem with what you mentioned. It is the syrup and there are many posts on this site where people just get a funnel. I am sorry to say there is not alot you can do about it. The late season syrup ends up getting a thin slime that coats the filter papers right away and shuts you down from filteriing. That is about all I can ever get through mine, so I usually mix small amounts in with better B and end up getting a bit more through that way.

[Lazarus]

Yesterday's slow filter and early plug up on C-grade was certainly understandable and I agree with your theory on that bit of syrup. But today is very different.

This year we ran everything into 5 gallon bulk containers off the evaporator, so I had the entire season's worth waiting to be filtered until I bought the press. We stopped boiling nearly a month ago. So, I'm not filtering it as it comes off the evaporator in succession; I'm just grabbing the containers randomly. The one I'm trying to filter right now is actually an early-mid season dark amber and I can't get anything through the press. And it processed B grade no sweat yesterday.

Today isn't a gradual decline in filtering. This is a catastrophic difference between what I was getting yesterday and how it's working today. Something happened to the press, I just can't figure out what.

[WMF]

I would bet you have at least one plate or frame backwards or maybe all of them. Follow the outlet of the gear pump, it should dump into the open frames.

[Lazarus]

I wish it was that easy - all of the frames on the Wes Fab are very, very clearly marked from the top to keep them aligned the right way. There's really no screwing that up unless one is blind. :)

[markcasper]

I don't know....seems to me its the syrup. If its not that, its hard to say unless I was standing there. Is your infeed tightened and not pulling air? there isn't a faulty valve or anything stuck 3/4 closed?

The syrup does not have to be black C grade. So what if it was early to mid season syrup, if it was warm, the syrup may have picked up that "slime" condition until conditions changed and the weather got better and thus sap quality better. Usually its only towards the end...but not always...2007 year for example.

I had some last year that was medium amber in color, but it wouldn't go through because it had the gel - slime to it.

Your pretty sure its not the gear pump as you wouldn't get 70psi if it was that. I'd check the little holes in the bottom of the plates, make sure they aren't plugged with ??

[NH Maplemaker]

I agree with WMF! On most wes Fab press there are bump on the side of each plate! They must be lined up or they will do as you have discribed. Feel both sides of the head plate you should find them. The next plate will be a thick one,(or hollow) then a solid and so on untill it is complet! also syrup shoud be hot. Check it out and let us know what you find, also I have filterd hundred and hundred of gallions of syrup through my filter and have never had to wet the pappers. JimL.

[gmcooper]

I have always wet the papers before instaling them in the press. That was the way i was shown to do it when I bought it from the dealer. I have had a few producers over the past several years complain about a similar problem in not getting syrup thru the press. It turns out that after finally wetting papers and heating the syrup to boiling or close they had no problem (providing they got the plates in correctly).

[RollinsOrchards]

I don't own a filter press, but my thoughts:

How are you getting the syrup out of the container? Are you perhaps sticking the suction hose of the pump down into the sugar sand at the bottom of the container first?

I made some syrup the night before last that would plug solid a 18 inch diameter disk of pre-filter every quart! I spent 2 hours getting 2 gallons roughly filtered before the finishing stage. In that case I could see the crud on the filter though, so I knew the problem.

[Lazarus]

The DE is mixed thoroughly into the syrup and it is all in suspension when the hose goes in. I mix it in 10 degrees before it's ready, then stir really good right before the press is turned on. There's nothing on the bottom, it's properly suspended.

I can absolutely positively assure the group, I am 100% sure I have it assembled correctly with the frames and the papers in the right locations. The alignment markings are unmistakeable and I've no difficulty finding them or putting them in the right order. I ran it an entire day yesterday with no problems. Double and triple checked it today all three times I assembled and broke down the press trying to get it working. The frames are set up correctly.

The syrup is actually not very dirty, and I know what you mean by the slime, but this isn't a slimy batch. Verified each and every tiny hole is clean and clear on every frame. Verified there are no blockages and it runs hot water perfectly. I've tried the papers both wet and dry and there is no difference - it plugs immediately on syrup either way. Yesterday I ran the syrup through at exactly 195 degrees which is what the instructions said and never had a problem. I tried today at 195 as well as around 215, no difference. Still won't run. I really don't think it's the syrup ... yesterday I ran everything from a medium amber to a C and it ran seemingly fine. Today, nothing but blowouts trying to prime it.

[markcasper]

I was thinking, is there a piece of large scale or something in the piping between the pressure gauge and the beginning of the plate? I have seen it where something like this would let water pass seemingly fine, but syrup a different story.

I do not know what else to tell you....its not a complicated machine by any means and there has to be a solution, it was made to work. The belt is not slipping? I hate to ask when you already stated your getting 70psi. I will be interested to hear the future results because you have me stumped! Mark

[hotfire]

I am on my second new press this year , i had the same problem , spike & then blow a paper , couldn't get more than a gallon through , after i had the same problem with second one , i took it back to were i got it and they tried with there syrup . Same problem , third one one it's way. Must have been a friday fab job .

[maplecrest]

if you are filtering syrup made earlier in season. i refilter my syrup when jugging. i only use 4 plates. i cut ss tubes that slide over the threaded rod to tighten down the press. i get syrup to at leat 180 degrees to run thru press.last year i had one boiling day that i had to press the same drum 3 times to get clear. no boiling day or batch of syrup is the same. this was a very strange year.i had sugar sand one day. alot of lime for three days even in the permeate.and mud the rest of the season. the last week i could not get even a gallon thru my presses. light colored rope syrup will not filter thru a press

[lpakiz]

I am just wondering if the press plates were assembled in a different order on the second day. Could you have one faulty plate not correctly machined (drilled) that is in a different position now than it was the first day? Not sayiong it is assembled wrong--just in a different order?? A plate with a missing hole (or plugged, as Mark Casper suggests) might work in a position farther from the inlet, but restrict flow if near the inlet?

[softmaple]

that sounds good, look to see if each wafer plate has 6 small holes for the output on each side (Front and Back) for a total of 12 small holes and see if there first, next see if there blocked?

[waysidemaple]

I used 4 cups of DE in my first five gallons after changing the papers. I have a full bank that was having pressure problems but turns out I wasn't using enough DE. Id try doubling the amount of DE.

Scott

[RileySugarbush]

We had a similar occurrence our last batch this year. Previously everything worked fine, filtered slightly heavy syrup hot and right off the evaporator. Charged the syrup with DE and it went right through our press from Daryl.

Our last batch was dark B and we got about 5 to 10 pumps on the hand pump and it stopped!

We gave up for the night in disgust!

A few days later we tried again. The syrup was hinting at ropy, it stirred funny and hung a bit on the spoon in an unnatural manner. Forging on (why not?) we reheated in the water jacket bottler, thinned it down to syrup. We assembled the press with wet papers and charged it with hot water and DE to make sure the papers didn't get coated with syrup first. This worked fine, even with the marginal syrup. I'm not sure what we will do with the stuff, but it is clear and no more hints of ropyness.

[mrnorthshore]

same problem here on the north shore. I can only get about 3 gal through my full bank press before it hits 70-80 psi. Early season I filtered 35 gal before it got to 50 psi.

[adkrover]

I purchased a new Wes fab press this year and first thing had what you described. Called the dealer and he suggested that I had the end plate on upside down. All of my regular plates were correct but the end cap was upside down. Runs great now but I am still getting slightly cloudy syrup. How long should it recirculate? What about doubling the papers just in case I'm getting small blow out or tear that I can't see.

Trust me, I was sure I had all the plates correct but that last one is tricky.

[maple flats]

Should be no need for double papers. You might need more DE. When you start filtering get the DE mixed completely by recirculating into the mix pot before sending it thru. Then I found mine (not Wes Fab) works best if I filter back into the mix pot until it looks good and clear out the discharge hose, then I transfer discharge to my canner without shutting the pump off by discharging into a SS 2 qt pot I have during the transfer. Then I dump that back into the mix pot to be run thru the filter again. When I used to shut the pump off, transfer to the canner and restart, I would get a brief surge of cloudy that showed in the finished product. My way gives completely clear syrup on all grades, even B and C.

[sapman]

I purchased a new Wes fab press this year and first thing had what you described. Called the dealer and he suggested that I had the end plate on upside down. All of my regular plates were correct but the end cap was upside down. Runs great now but I am still getting slightly cloudy syrup. How long should it recirculate? What about doubling the papers just in case I'm getting small blow out or tear that I can't see.

Trust me, I was sure I had all the plates correct but that last one is tricky.

I did the same thing with my Wes Fab on the first use back in '96. Called him and everything. But I've never had cloudy syrup as long as everything is in right.