Flat mainlines

[sapman]

I changed my system this year over to pretty much flat mains, eliminating the sap ladders which I was never satisfied with. This way, I could run dry lines. So I teed in the dry line at every lateral main (instead of manifolds). But so far the sap just seems to fill the wet line and move very little. My thinking was the vacuum would pull better. But now I wonder if the vac from the dry line is sort of competing and pulling the sap back in the wrong direction toward the tees, too. I know the real solution is to get some slope to the mainline, which will be quite a challenge. Anyone else ever struggle with this?

Thanks,
Tim

[PATheron]

Tim- I know some other people have the same thing happen. Thing to do is get some small amount of pitch on the mainline then itll work. Even if it slugs that will be alright somewhat becouse of the dry line but it has to go down hill enough to come out of it. If you eliminate the dry line it will come out of it but it will always be slugging and messing up the vac to the trees. Run the line high at the end or something so it will run out and invert the lats. Inverted lats are better than mainline with no slope in my opinion. Theron

[Rossell's Sugar Camp]

What are inverted laterals?

[gmcooper]

Inverted lateral are laterals that are lower than the mainline. They work but are not very efficient as they tend to stay full of sap even under vacuum unless there is a small leak at the far end. Also tend to allow sap to sit in or flow back into the tap hole. It is best to avoid an inverted lateral or drop line if at all possible.

[gmcooper]

Sapman, There was a 1000 tap bucket operation north of us that was basically all on river bottom land with little if any pitch. They didn't use tubing for many years till someone helped them set up a system. They put the tank as low as possible and worked slightly up from there. 1% pitch maybe. They had to use a step ladder to tap the far end of the bush. They did this all without vacuum and I believe they made more syrup than on buckets.

[sapman]

Thanks for the thoughts guys! These ideas have been on my mind, so I appreciate the opinions about my options. I'm using a belly releaser to keep the mains as low as possible. Biggest hindrance is the potential for water rising a couple feet, causing me to have to start about 4'+ high. Right now I'm adding tiebacks and posts to stiffen and keep sags to a minimum.

[PATheron]

Tim- Go nuts on the posts, theyll help a lot. Theron

[Brian Ryther]

Tim
If your dry line is staying dry the the system is working. Durring run time hydrualic pressure will push the sap down the wet line to the releaser. You may inclunter freeze issues but the dry line will run the sap until it thaws out.

[sapman]

Yeah, unfortunately the dry line was also filling with sap. But I am hopeful that with the addition of more sideties and posts, that it may stop happening. Also, I have valves still in the line from the ladder systems, which create "bumps". Think I'm going to replace them all with couplings, maybe stainless, to get it tied up neater.

[Brent]

you may want to put a valve on the dry line near the releaser so you can close it off for the last few minutes before you shut down at night. That will force the vac to suck most
of the sap out of the wet line before freeze up and reduce ice / thaw issues the next morning.

[sapman]

That's a good point, Brent. I do have a valve there. Will try it sometime.