First Time Tuber

[Groves]

Ok, we're steam pan batch people.

We live in a city in southwest Missouri, and there are tons of maples around, but rarely close to each other.

Last year I spotted sap nirvana (sorta) when I spied a church with 14 maples all in a neat row. We did buckets that year.

This year I'm trying tubing. Bought some slide fittings, some T's, some end rings.


So we're out in the cold, my boys underdressed, so they're cold already. We had a mostly unused roll of tubing from last year and we hoped it would last us.

Mistake #1: no tubing uncoiler

So that was a fun 20minutes untangling the rest of the roll.

The trees are 20-30ft apart, and on a gentle slope. We have a collection barrel at the end, and then my brain freezes. Not like eating ice cream, but it locks up. I can't remember if I'm supposed to run a line all the way down the trees and then come back and cut in my Ts, or do section by section.

It's getting dark, so we just started at the barrel and stretched to the first tree and then the next. Got only 4 done, will have to finish on Monday.

I have no idea how much slope we need, or if we have it. I don't want to tap high just to gain slope, but I guess we do need slope to let it run.

I don't have a tubing tool, so I think when we run the remaining 10 maples I won't stretch the line tight before I put in the T's. Seems like I'm chasing line half the time.

I DID do the hot water in thermos trick. Nice.

I am finding myself greatly lured to the idea of putting a nail in the T to fix it to the tree. Does this damage the tree much? Lose a lot of sap? Can nails in the T's be used to keep the line tight? Is 30ft too much to keep out objectionable sags?

Lots of questions from this bucket guy.

[maple flats]

When I did tubing into barrels I started at the uphill end, installed an end ring (or hook if being taken down after the season) with the tap leg facing upward, then stretched the tubing to the last downhill tree, weaving back and forth so each tapable tree you pass has tubing tight against it. At the low tree I again used an end ring fitting but now the leg that faced up on tree 1 faces down to drain. Nowe run the drain tubing into your barrel. If the tubing is tight a 1% slope will work (1' drop/100' run) but more is better. For gravity get as much as is practical. Start tree 1 as high as you can comfortably reach and the last tree as low as practical to remain above snow level and still be high enough to drain into the bbl. My barrels were done 2 ways. Larger runs I used a 55 gal bbl laid on it's side and cut a 10 x 10 hole in the side. I used a piece of aluminum to cover the hole and ran a bungie around the bbl to hold it. (the bungie was either an official bungie, extended using 1/8" rope around the bbl or a piece of inner tube made into a rubber band extended the same way). My other bbl method on smaller tap legs was a 1/2 bbl, cut at the middle and stood on end. For these I had plywood covers made up with 2x2's attached under to hold the cover from sliding off. Ones in high wind areas were held by a rock on top. In both methods I drilled a hole or sometimes 2 in the bbl close to the fill opening, this hole was sized to slide the tubing into the bbl fairly snug (I forget the size, experiment), inside the bbl I placid a spring clamp to capture the tubing. The tubing from the last tree to the nearby bbl was sloped down but not stretched tight, all other tree to tree tubing was kept tight. As tubing stretched I had an adjustment at each end ring to re tighten it. Now go back and install the drops. This is where a 2 hand tool is the biggest help but if you don't have one dip the ends in hot water, just the last 3/8-1/2" and using your helpers to pull the tubing to help, push the tubing onto the tee. Drops are best made up at home ahead of time, make your drop long enough to reach as far as you will need. I started using 24" drops years ago, then after 1 year I made 28" drops, I now make 32" drops. So far I think I like the 32's best because I can better reach to tap the entire tree. Being on gravity you might have 1,2, or 3 taps depending on tree diameter. If a tree looks healthy I used 1 tap for 10-18" trees, 2 for 18-25" trees and 3 for over 25 " diameter, at tapping height. I never ran 4 or more except 1 tree in a yard on buckets years ago that was about 5' diameter and looked very healthy that got 4. If a tree looks less than great health, reduce number of taps. The sap you remove will not damage the tree but trees of less vigor don't recover at the tap hole as fast. Do not favor the sunny side of the tree, use a uniform blend of exposures so as you tap in fiture years you still have a blend of exposures as you move tap locations in a pattern around the tree, never tap in an old tap hole.

[Groves]

That's all great advice.

Can I stretch it tight, and then mark with a sharpie the location of the drops? This would allow me to cut them in without tension and then tighten it up later, right?

I know that the locations will shift some as I continue to tighten over the season.

Is there such a thing as too tight? Am I expecting too much out of unsupported tubing over a 30ft span? Is there any benefit to leaving the line all on one side of the tree (the sunny side) to help with thawing in the mornings (instead of weaving it slalom style through the line of trees)?

[Goggleeye]

I'd agree with just about everything maple flats said.

Here's the method that's worked great for me.

1. Make your drops (T with 32-26" of line ahead of time)
2. Wire an end-line ring to the top tree and connect your line.
3. Unroll to the bottom, weaving between the trees for friction to hold the line up.
4. Pull the line as tight as you can to estimate where to put in the bottom end-line ring. Leave about 12 inches for tightening. Connect the end-line ring and wire it to the bottom tree, or if you have a good anchor tree reasonably close to the last tree, wire it to that. At this point, don't pull it tight yet.
5. Go back to the 2nd to top tree and splice in your T. I cut the line with a pruning shears. If you have at least two helpers, you can make quick work of it by having one hold the thermos of boiling hot water. You hold the uphill side of the line and have the other helper hold the downhill side of the line to keep it from coiling away from you. Once you cut the line, dip the uphill side and insert the T. Then dip the downhill side and insert the T.
6. Work your way down the line, always keeping good tension on the uphill side.
7. If you anchor to your last maple, I T in about 3-4 inches above the end-line ring. Depending on the tree, the drop for that last one may need to be a bit longer. You may have to cut out a short segment of line in order to get it really tight, but this is the method that I've found works best for us.

Mark

[danno]

That's all great advice.

Is there such thing as too tight? Am I expecting too much out of unsupported tubing over a 30ft span? Is there any benefit to leaving the line all on one side of the tree (the sunny side) to help with thawing in the mornings (instead of weaving it slalom style through the line of trees)?

Too tights is when you're pulling the fittings out of the tubing - hard to do but possible. Also too tight would be when you are collapsing the wall of the tubing. Short of either of these and your good to go. You want to weave the lateral through the trees as the "serpantine" allows the trees to support the lateral. You'll see as you begin hanging tubing.

[SevenCreeksSap]

Being new to tubing too I'm slapping my forehead for not thinking of an end ring on the bottom tree. Seems like you need a T if your last tree is a Maple for the tap, Or do they make end rings with three openings? ( two for flow thru,1 for drop)

Just a comment on nailing tees, it doesnt seem like a good idea. if you do, and then you get sag, how do you pull it out? You may also want to check any state laws regarding tree damage. In our state if you dont own the tree you cannot do any damage without written permission (eg, permanent tree stand, I assume tapping too.) I know a tap hole is already doing some harm to the tree though it will heal over, but you are also introducing another hole directly above your tap, with something that may introduce rust and other natural bacteria which seems like it could cause your tap hole to dry up faster. Try the end rings to tighten and see if that works. If things slide down try wire around the tree.

[sugar ED]

"Just a comment on nailing tees, it doesnt seem like a good idea" to me eather, I've cut alot of fire wood and there's nothing like cutting into a nail !!! It also cracks the tree ,like driving the tap to far into the tree ,sap all over but little down the line
I agree with ya, sags in line stink, On my trees that are more than 10'to15' apart I run a guide wire top to bottom(hardware store /walley world) and to hold the ends, I go around the tree with old 5/16 hose over the wire to protect the tree ,top of line/hill wire is solid ancored .At the bottom I loop last tree (wire inside hose)and make it so I can tighten it up if sagging ,I like the little ratchet hold down straps just for that ! Also my tees have a small hole that I use ,put wire thru hole wrap back around it's self and the other end around tree with hose over wire ...
Groves post...."14 Maple trees /The trees are 20-30ft apart, and on a gentle slope. We have a collection barrel at the end " Ok sounds like about 300' to 400' line run ? and how big are the trees ,1,2,3 taps per tree ?.....If more than one tap per tree..and using only 5/16 line ,(No main line) no more than 15 to 20 taps per line ...go strait to collection barrel and start over with another line (now side by side)thru the rest of trees to barrow again .Many way to skin a cat. lol
Hope this helps, Ed

[Goggleeye]

Being new to tubing too I'm slapping my forehead for not thinking of an end ring on the bottom tree. Seems like you need a T if your last tree is a Maple for the tap, Or do they make end rings with three openings? ( two for flow thru,1 for drop)

I've thought the same. This is my 3rd year running gravity lines and I just now figured out the best thing to do is place an end ring at the bottom, and a T just above it if there is a maple. I try to go past if I can, though, to create a little more drop to the barrel. I used to rig up a T at the bottom. I think it will be a lot easier to take down and put up, as well as tighten with the end-rings on both ends.

Mark

[Leadft]

I have a few spots like that myself and if the trees have much size at all you can end up with 30-50 taps... I use a length of 1/2" main line to run from the barrel to about 3/4 of the trees and then you can run 5/16 lines to the end with a star tee... You can always skip a tree or two then install another star tee... If you have the room for gravity to work you can go both ways from the stars to minimize the star fittings in your main line...