Booster tank/ manifolds

[spud]

As i set up my wood this year i decided to go with booster tanks instead of booster manifolds in my wet/dry system. My thought was this (and i don't always think right:confused:) I have 5 booster tanks in my woods with six 1 inch mains coming out of them. That gives me 30 mainlines none of which are longer then 850 feet or so. No main has more then 200 taps on it. If i used booster manifolds i would have to make 30 of them. After looking at the way they are made it appears you would need a minimum of 8 clamps to build one and maybe more.My thought is this is 8 potential vac leaks. Now 8x30=240 potential leaks. My 30 mainlines plug right into my booster tank using only 30 clamps which is 210 less then if i used manifolds. My thought was i really don't want to cut into my wet/dry system at all. I always felt the more cuts the more potential problems. I am not saying that my way is better but i am wondering if my thinking is on the right track. I know there are a lot of Traders that are doing one way or the other and sometimes both ways. I also understand that every woods is different and you have to go with what works best in your situation. If you did have a woods that could accept either system which one would YOU choose and WHY. There has got to be pro's and con's to both systems. I do have a shut off valve at the booster to every one of my mainlines just to help find leaks faster. Thanks:)

Spud

[ennismaple]

Your logic is sound, makes sense dollar-wise and should work just as well as a wet/dry system. Let us know how it works for you!

[spud]

My boosters worked great this year. I talked to a very large producer tonight from Fairfield Vermont and he assured me that the booster was the way to go. I think anyone setting up a new woods should really consider going with booster's.

Spud

[MapleChaser]

I have been following this debate on boosters versus the whip booster. I think it all depends on your woods. I have been useing the whip boosters. But you have got me thinking about your idea as I start my new section of woods. I would like to try your method my question is how do you hook the booster tank? Do you tie off to a tree? Build a stand for it? Also what size do you go with? 6inch or 8 inch? My new woods is going to have 6 1inch lines also coming into it. If you could send a pic of how you secure it to a tree. Thanks MC

[spud]

If you send me a private message with your e-mail address then I could send you some photos. My boosters are 16x24 inches. I built stands for all the booster's and they work great. Once all the lines are attached nothing is going to move it. I never had to strap the booster to the tree because it just stays in place.

Spud

[NH Maplemaker]

spud, Why not post your pictures here so we all can see them? You have me thinking as well and sure some others ! Thanks, JimL.

[Sunday Rock Maple]

Not sure I'm understanding the layout. Does the booster with six lines coming out of it look like the ribs and base of a hand fan (like ladies used to use)? If so, I have one place in our woods that looks like that with five lines coming into a dual pipe sap ladder for about 350 tabs. I'm thinking of replacing the ladder with a lift or reverse slope releaser --- which I think would act about the same as a booster. Normally we come off our wet/dry with a "Y" and a whip loop (instead of a manifold) to each main, would you now not do that at all and have the fan layout instead of the Christmass tree type?

[spud]

Yes the booster set up will look like the fan. I don't know much about sap ladder's so I would hate to mis-guide you. I do know that you loose vacuum with sap ladder's so by having a booster tank you (might) regain CFMs. Cornell or Proctor could help you on this one. I would ask Dr. Tim first.

Spud

[Amber Gold]

After hearing all this talk, I may convert a junction I have into a booster. The end of my wet/dry has three mainlines coming into it w/in 20' of each other. I was going to convert all these fittings over to stainless to get the full ID, but I think I'd have almost as much in s/s fittings as I would in a booster. The significant drop in fittings, and their resulting potential for vac. leaks, is mighty appealing.

Question I have is, if the wet and dry lines both tie into the front of the booster, how does the sap know to go down the wet line?

[spud]

The wet line fitting is at the side/bottom and the dry line fitting is at the side/top.

Spud

[royalmaple]

The only way you'll get it to work properly and trust me I've tried many different ways it to put a large arrow on the inside of the pipe pointing down.

[Thompson's Tree Farm]

And Matt returns with a bang!:lol:

[Amber Gold]

Thanks Matt. All clear now.

[Amber Gold]

Spud, do you use horizontal or vertical boosters? Pictures??

[spud]

Spud, do you use horizontal or vertical boosters? Pictures??

Josh,

I use the vertical boosters from WH Supply. I just bought two more last week for $238.00 each. I think the size is 18x24. I am working on Photos.

Spud

[Howard]

I have several 3/4 in lines that are 2000 feet off the wet dry line. vac is 26 in. at the end. Would I get more vac if I installed a tank say 1/2 way up the line? I'm running 28 1/2 at the sugarhouse. Howard

[spud]

It is said that booster tanks should be at every 1000 feet. They really are just vacuum transfer tanks. The only way to get more CFMs to the far ends of your woods is by running larger mainlines. According to the charts 3/4 inch mains running 2000 feet will only give you 4 CFMs. Most sugar maker's will tell you that 4 CFMs is good for 400 taps but according to Cornell's studies you should have twice that amount. So in reality 4 CFMs is good for more like 200 taps. So as long as you have no more then 200 taps per line or close to that you should be just fine. Last year there were times I ran 29.5 at the pump and 28 at 2000 feet or better. I always ran 1 1/2 difference. If the barometric pressure dropped my vacuum would drop also but the woods would always be 1 1/2 difference. I put a little silicon on my mainline fittings and I was able to bring the vacuum up one inch at the end. I used to have a 2 1/2 difference from pump to woods. My friends tell me I'm crazy for spending all that time just for one more inch of vacuum. They say anything over 25 inches is good enough.

Spud

[Howard]

So I would come off wet Dry manifold 1000ft.of 3/4in. connect booster 3/4in out 1000ft?

[maple flats]

You will be far better with 1" the first 1000. Many consider 1000' of 3/4" to be the max for decent vacuum transfer. The extra spent now will yield more sap for 10-15 yrs. In fact I no longer buy 3/4", my mains will all leave the wet/dry conductors as 1" and my conductors are 1.5" dry over 1.25" wet on a system that will someday max at about 2000-2200 taps. Vac transfer is more important than vac at the pump. A undersized main can not be boosted with a better pump since the vac does not make it out far enough.

[spud]

So I would come off wet Dry manifold 1000ft.of 3/4in. connect booster 3/4in out 1000ft?

That really would not make any difference at all. The key to vacuum transfer is sizing your mainlines right. A transfer tank will only maintain and balance vacuum out before moving to the next location. What it won't do is increase your vacuum or your CFMs. The only way to increase CFMs is bigger pipe. The question is how many taps do you have on the 2000 feet of 3/4 mainline? Are all the taps at the end or are there some along the way? If your system is really tight then the 4 CFMs you have could handle 400 taps. The studies show that by playing it safe you should double your CFMs. Keep in mind though that even if you put up 1 1/4 main instead of 3/4 pipe your vacuum will be the same as it was with the 3/4 inch mainline. The only difference would be you would have more CFMs allowing you to have more taps at the end of you 2000 feet.

Spud

[Howard]

Thank you both for great info. Spud, 400 taps are spaced on both sides of the new road that we built. There are no more taps in this area. I see now that the 3/4 will work fine for this area. With no boosters. 26in. of vac is good but 27+ is better.

[GeneralStark]

Here are some photos of some booster tanks in a local sugarbush. The grey mainlines are wet and dry lines (dry above wet) and the smaller diameter green or grey are lateral mainlines.619962006201