Bottling advice

[NJG]

My third year making syrup on a small scale and looking for any advice to be offered on my bottling set up. Made five gallons and after finishing and filtering, I used the piggy back pan to bottle. I brought it up to 185 fairly quickly, then bottled it up in beer bottles and set them on their side until they cooled. So far, all looks good but have a few questions......

I used a coleman camp stove to heat for bottling, stirring almost constantly. As it got up to temp I noticed what I am guessing was sugar sticking to the side of the pan. It scraped off pretty easy, but not sure if I should do this. Is it better to leave the "scrapings" on the side of the pan or scrape them off and stir then in? Make any difference for density?

It is better to heat it up slowly to bottle or fast? I understand that the longer syrup/sap is on the heat, the darker it is likely to be. Not super concerned about the color at the small scale I am at, but it all else is equal I would prefer to heat it up quickly and not be standing around as long waiting.

How long is it necessary to leave bottles on their sides after bottling? It's amazing how much space 50 or so beer bottles take up on the counter!

Thanks again for any ideas

[Haynes Forest Products]

Are you using new crown caps? 2 minuets is all it takes to sterilize the cap. I'm not sure if those caps will stay sealed for hot packing then cooling.

[3rdgen.maple]

Im just trying to figure out how he is using a piggy back to bottle with.

[NJG]

3rdgen,

I'm guessing piggy back is not the right term to be using here. I have a 2' x 4' flat pan with a small, 1' x 2' pre-heater pan that sits on top of the evap pan. I took the pre-heat pan and put it on a Coleman stove for bottling. Works pretty good as far as I can tell.

Haynes,

Yeah, using new caps. What should I be looking for if they are not staying sealed? Mold?

My first year I was using only a thermometer and took it all a little too far. Bottled it up in mason jars and had plenty of candy at the bottom. Last year I used the hydrometer but when I heated it up to bottle I used a stock pot on an electric stove. Half way through I had tiny little bubbles coming up from the bottom. Before too long I had sediment in the bottom of my jars.

This year I was able to regulate the temp much better and bottle it much faster, but still worried about the "crust" on the side of the pan as I was heating it up. Not sure if I went too fast or too slow heating it up, or if the "crust" is sugar, which would throw off my density.

Obviously with a total of 5 gallons I'm in this for the fun and everything is being given away to family and friends, but if there is something I'm doing wrong I would just as soon make some changes and do it right. If you have any advice or questions, I'm all ears!

Thanks,

Nick

[Big_Eddy]

I leave my bottles laying down for about an hour. As the syrup cools, a vaccuum will develop. If the caps are leaking, a telltale string of small bubbles will form from the cap. Stand that one up, tighten it, then lay it down again.

(Don't tighten it with the bottle on its side - sometimes a hot cap will stretch and pop off when you tighten it. Not a problem when the bottle is vertical)

[TF Maple]

If this is filtered syrup you are heating and canning, heating it fast will make hot spots on the bottom and create sugar sand.

[Haynes Forest Products]

NJG if the seal breaks it will leak back and forth as it cools and heats just sitting in the house .....Mold. Get a double boiler and remember you can boil the inner liquid BUT if you run it up and keep an eye on it you will be better off.

[PerryW]

For syrup I am selling, I would never dare to reheat syrup without refiltering it.

I heat up between 5 and 10 gallons of syrup at a time. I use a stainless 12"x20" filter canner (without the filter rack) that covers two burners on the stove. While heating, I take several hydrometer readings and (using the temp. vs. density chart) I standardize my syrup using the formula to know how much water to add.

When the temp reaches 198 deg., I open the valve and run all the syrup into another 12" x 20" canner with a felt flat filter and a 50 deg-250 deg dial-thermometer. I sewed together a couple bath towels that I wrap around the unit to hold in the heat and put another towel over the cover. Then I fill plastic jugs until the temp drops to 185 degrees, then I stop canning.

[NJG]

Thanks for the info guys. PerryW, do you reheat and refilter if the syrup gets below 185 while you are canning?

[PerryW]

Thanks for the info guys. PerryW, do you reheat and refilter if the syrup gets below 185 while you are canning?

Since I'm doing 5 -10 gallons at a time, I can usually get all but the last 1/2 - 3/4 of a gallon out of the filter/canner before the dial-thermometer (on the filter-canner) drops below 185. At this point I stop bottling and put the remaining syrup in another container which I put in the refrigerator and add it to the next batch of syrup. Again, it helps immensely to insulate the filter-canner to slow the cooling of the syrup.

[ckkrotz]

I've been trying to find a good way to bottle my syrup as well. I use canning jars, and I was thinking about heating the filtered syrup up in the jars in a hot water bath. Anyone have any ideas if that would sterilize them enough? I'm thinking that might be more even heating than just in a pan on my stove as I had been doing. I have a steamer insert for my spaghetti pan that fits 5 pint jars, and I would fill the pot with water, then heat up the jars in the water, using the steamer to remove the jars when they're hot enough. I would heat them uncovered, and cover them and turn them on their sides when they hit 190 degrees... I've read that this is one way to pasteurize milk on a small scale, so it seems like it should work to me, but is there something I'm not thinking of? Thanks.

[happy thoughts]

I've been trying to find a good way to bottle my syrup as well. I use canning jars, and I was thinking about heating the filtered syrup up in the jars in a hot water bath. Anyone have any ideas if that would sterilize them enough? I'm thinking that might be more even heating than just in a pan on my stove as I had been doing. I have a steamer insert for my spaghetti pan that fits 5 pint jars, and I would fill the pot with water, then heat up the jars in the water, using the steamer to remove the jars when they're hot enough. I would heat them uncovered, and cover them and turn them on their sides when they hit 190 degrees... I've read that this is one way to pasteurize milk on a small scale, so it seems like it should work to me, but is there something I'm not thinking of? Thanks.

Pasteurizing milk is not the same as canning. The purpose and storage times of either method really don't compare to one another. I'm not quite sure what you're after and what you're describing seems a little to much bother if you ask me:). Why a water bath with open filled jars? I 'm pretty sure that won't sterilize the jars.

If it's sterile you want then why not just boil the jars for 10 minutes as you would for canning. This is what I do with my own jars for syrup. After that you can water bath the filled and closed hot packed jars if you want as you would for jam or jelly. Five minutes ought to do it but have to say I just hot pack into sterile jars and seal without the water bath.

[NJG]

Ah, gottcha. By filter/canner, do you mean the water jacket canner that Haynes was talking about, or simply a single walled pan with thermometer and valve bushings? I read a thread by Riley from MN making a water jacket canner out of two different sized stainless stock pots. Really peaked my curiousity and looking forward to seeing more on that down the road.

I like your idea PerryW, and even with my small time set up I think I can swing that. I'm not selling anything and don't see that happening for years to come, but the better it looks when I give it away the happier I am.

Now about the water bath ideas... Correct me if I am wrong but wouldn't heating syrup after it's in a container just create more niter?

[ckkrotz]

What I'm trying to do is heat it to 190 without over heating it to form niter. My stove is really bad about hot spots so just to get the syrup of enough in some places it will be too hot in others. I was thinking some people use a double boiler to heat the syrup up for bottling. My goal in heating the syrup in the jars is the same as using a double boiler, except the syrup would already be in the jars so I would just have to put the covers on and turn them on their side. The jars would already be sterilized in the dishwasher before the syrup was put in.

[happy thoughts]

What I'm trying to do is heat it to 190 without over heating it to form niter. My stove is really bad about hot spots so just to get the syrup of enough in some places it will be too hot in others. I was thinking some people use a double boiler to heat the syrup up for bottling. My goal in heating the syrup in the jars is the same as using a double boiler, except the syrup would already be in the jars so I would just have to put the covers on and turn them on their side. The jars would already be sterilized in the dishwasher before the syrup was put in.

OK gotcha. First you're using clean jars not sterilized jars. Sterilizing jars requires a boiling water bath of at least 10 minutes. Just a fine point but you had asked earlier if the jars would be sterile if heated to 190 and the answer is no. Second, there's some volume increase when syrup is heated so knowing where to fill the jars might not be so easy doing it the way you propose. I'd also worry about moisture or water getting into the syrup diluting it.

Using a double boiler or a stock pot within a stock pot seems a better idea to me because you can then fill the jars with slightly cooler syrup leaving a smaller amount of headspace. But that said, if your syrup was pretty clear to begin with and you're careful not to go past 200F, you aren't going to have that much niter develop if any. Is this syrup just for your own use only? If so, I wouldn't sweat the small stuff:)

[Haynes Forest Products]

fFlling a bottle and sealing it cold, warm or near 190 and then heating it will not help seal the bottle. Heating the syrup in the bottle will force syrup into the seal area and cause problems. Sealing a bottle of HOT syrup and allowing the syrup to cool and shrink will seal the caps to the lip. Plastic caps can strip, shrink and become lose and if sealed by vacuum it can remain sealed. I think KEEP IT SIMPLE is the key. If your reheating finished syrup go slow. Now you can start by boiling a large pot of water and set a smaller pot in it so you transfer the heat from the boiling water to the syrup and then bring it up to the finish bottling temp and bottle, cap, lay on side put in box.