Newbee in Broad Brook [Archive]

newbee

02-17-2011, 03:42 PM

Thanks for the welcome. Always wanted to do this. I'm planning on cooking in a pot on a stove top top, but reading through the site, I'm getting the idea that maybe the outdoor gas grill mabe a better palce to evaporate. Your Thoughts? Thanks for the heads up too on maple guys.com.

If you don't mind another question, I notices this morning that one tap (w/ 3-gal bucket)was 1/4 full by morning. I had just tapped last night, and it was dripping before the drill bit was fully out, but 5 others I tapped earlier that morning were dry when the bit came out, and had all day and had maybe a 1/4 of a cup of sap 12 hours later. Could I have hammer the tap in too hard on the other 5? The 1 that was dripping also had a large wet spot on the bark around the tap. probably a good 8 " ring of wet spot. Others don't have that.

Littlesap

02-17-2011, 04:15 PM

You can certainly do the gas grill but if you're going to use propane you might want to pick up a propane fired outdoor pot boiler - I have one that is used for cooking lobster. They're ~$20 but I can not remember where I bought mine. You want as vigorous a boil as possible which is tough to achieve on a conventional gas grill.

Lots of folks use a cement block arch (kind of like a long fire pit) and steam table pans that you could pick up at a restaurant supply store. More surface area to boil and more direct contact with the flames.

Have fun, it's addictive

Mike Van

02-17-2011, 05:04 PM

Some taps really run strong, it's just luck in my opinion - The leak around that one should stop on it's own. You can pound them in too hard, it doesn't affect the way it runs, but will split the bark, cause it to leak, and make it a bear to get out when done. Some of those slow ones will pick up, some just don't. You really don't want the sap in the house boiling, and a gas grill burner is way too slow. I think some use the turkey fryer setup?

PapaSmiff

02-17-2011, 08:44 PM

I use a Turkey Fryer and it works out great, but it costs a lot in Propane. Next year I'm building or buying a small wood-fired evaporator. Definately do it OUTSIDE. I boil it to "near syrup" and then bring it inside on the stove. Even that small amount of boiling in the house steams up the kitched (we don't have a fan over the stove).

The hydrometer is a great investment. The consistency of my syrup is much, much better now that I have one.

Good Luck!

newbee

02-17-2011, 10:33 PM

WOW! You guys weren't kidding. Raised my humidity level in house 40%. What an awesome smell though. Home Depot here I come. Wife says I'm painting the kitchen when I done. And probably a new stove. Can't imagine what 100's of gallons would do. Thanks PapaSmiff, think I'll look into that turkey fryer.
LittleSap on the arch, do they boil in the pans over wood fire? And I am I right in that they rest the edges of the pans on the blocks like in the warming pans at a buffet line? By the way sweet pictures. Way jealous. Like the pallets holding up the tank. Great Idea. Very nice house. I now have a goal.

I collected @ 3 gallons and boiled in probably a 20 qt pan. Something like you would cook a lobster in. Added about ¼ gallon and kept adding by dripping out of a cup. Anything wrong with doing it that way to get a feel for this?

Mike you're right leak stopped. Hoping other taps will pick up. Have one tap that is only 2 ft off ground due to tree shape. Very little 2 tbs of sap, noticed they say 3-4 ft off ground. Will 2 ft work?

Littlesap

02-18-2011, 09:08 AM

Right on both counts. You can get rope gasket from the hardware store that is ordinarily used to seal an oven - the pans sit on that which lines the inside top edge of the concrete blocks. I lined the inside of my block arch with fire bricks to reflect the heat back into the fire pit which then travels up and increases the boiling - and extends the life of the concrete blocks. Everything on my set up was dry stacked, more cracks but you can take it apart and move it at the end of the season. I made the front fire box of mine about 2 feet deep and wide enough so the pans will overlap the width by 1". At the end of the firebox I built a ramp of sand/dirt/blocks (can't remember at this point) so the flame travels up and closer to the pans as it heads toward smoke stack at the back.

valleyman

02-18-2011, 09:44 AM

Hi Newbee,

I too am still new at this even though I have a couple of seasons behind me. Here's a link to some of my photos of my backyard set up. There's a photo of my finishing set up on propane. I do most of the boiling on a block evaporator.

Hope the photos will help.

http://s778.photobucket.com/albums/yy67/Valleyman_bucket/2010%20Maple%20Sugaring/

RyanFarms

02-18-2011, 12:33 PM

I was surprised to see Tractor Supply Co. in Southwick had sugaring supplies - hydrometer, filters, etc... Even 12oz glass bottles. Good for small scale hobby folks!

newbee

02-20-2011, 07:14 PM

Thanks littlesap. Might try and plan a house for next year, meanwhile I'll try this. Any suggestions on an evaoprator for a newbee future plans?

Great pictures Vallyman those help a lot to get an idea.

RyanFarms, I tried a my local John deer but no avail. Order onlie. Thanks.

Checked traps ayesterday and today, and not a drop. I gues it's too cold?

Tanta K

02-21-2011, 08:25 PM

Pick up the book Backyard Sugarin' - It gives a lot of great, basic advice for the beginnger. Kee it simple and you'll keep it sweet! And not wear yourself out in the meantime.

adk1

02-21-2011, 08:26 PM

Our local Ace Hardware had the plastic hanging buckets with lids and Soul Spouts last year. Havent seen them on the shelves this year yet. Had them for the same price as Leader sells them.

Tanta K

02-21-2011, 08:31 PM

Can't do tubing so we drive around in a Gator and collect the 29 we have out and then pump using an inline pump powerded by a drill! If we had tubing...we'd have hikers, snowshoers, X-country skiers, dog walkers, etc. all tangled up and sporting pretty blue necklaces! Will be teaching close to 1000this year so for me, it's enough!

TF Maple

02-21-2011, 08:37 PM

If you don't mind another question, I notices this morning that one tap (w/ 3-gal bucket)was 1/4 full by morning. I had just tapped last night, and it was dripping before the drill bit was fully out, but 5 others I tapped earlier that morning were dry when the bit came out, and had all day and had maybe a 1/4 of a cup of sap 12 hours later. Could I have hammer the tap in too hard on the other 5? The 1 that was dripping also had a large wet spot on the bark around the tap. probably a good 8 " ring of wet spot. Others don't have that.

This could possibly be the side of the tree that you tapped. The north side will run a little later in the season so it might not run much now. The south side will run better at the beginning of the season because it warms up first. The large wet spot would tell me the tap should be in a little tighter, it is leaking.

newbee

02-25-2011, 09:54 PM

Thanks TF. I tapped only south sides. I did a little research before I took the plunge, and read to only tap south side. So I listened. The leak stopped, and I tapped 12 more trees (4 were not maples . oops) still learning, but having fun.

newbee

02-25-2011, 10:46 PM

Has anyone experienced a worm (almost clear, translucent) in the sap before?

newbee

03-05-2011, 12:01 AM

Tapped another 9 trees this morning. Notice everything was frozen over night, but collected@ 8 gallons off of 15 taps. I've boiled a few buckets (5 gallons) or so down to quarts, and experimented with 5 gallons to see what happens when I tried to boil to syrup. Boiled down to probably 1 cup and it got really foamy at the end. I guess I went to far, cause I think I made maple sugar. Is that Possible? when I took it off the flame, it cooled and hardened. Tasted good though, not burt. Very sugary. trying to get a handel on this before I boil the quarts I've got. I know there are some experts out that can help. I don't want to burn the quarts I boiled down. Any advice is welcome!

Littlesap

03-05-2011, 06:00 AM

You can use a candy thermometer to keep track of the temp - boil water on top of the stove and write down the temp at which the water boils. Maple syrup boils at 7 degrees above the boiling point of water. One thing I learned is that you can get different readings from different thermometers so stick with the same one. I can't remember the boiling point for maple sugar - you can probably find it on one of the threads here - but hey, that tastes pretty darn good also :lol:

newbee

03-05-2011, 07:39 PM

Thanks Littlesap. I did buy a thermometer and hydometer. By the way if I add water to the sugar and microwave, it is "syrup like". My issue is I boil 5 - 10gallos down to a couple quarts of higher sugar content, but not syrup yet, and then refrigerate till I can get a couple 4-5 gallons of higher content. Then do a fianl boil. Is this ok to do?

I tried 5 gallons to boil down to see what it was like, so I don't burn or screw up the higher content quarts I'm saving to do a larger final boil. When I boiled the 5 gallons I notice near the end that it got really foamy brown small bubles that rose up the sides of the pan. Is that the conversion to syrup?

doorknob

03-08-2011, 10:42 PM

Watching all of these posts about tapping trees in Connecticut finally motivated me - I bought three pails, covers, and spiles, got out my portable drill, and went to work on three trees.

I'm not quite ready to boil the sap yet - I just ordered a Bayou Classic SP10 propane heater from amazon and hope that it arrives before I'm overwhelmed with sap.

So I'm a few steps behind you...

newbee

03-09-2011, 01:22 AM

Welcome to the club. I'll stumble along with you. I too orderd a king kooker (walmart) to see if I'm really going to build a house this summer. It's addicting. Got the bug.. Up to 25 taps already. look out. yikes? If I knew we'd have 3-4 more weeks I get more buckets.

Littlesap

03-09-2011, 10:27 AM

The little foaming bubbles are what you're looking for. I've not been able to nail it with just a thermometer and use a hydrometer at that point. There are many ways to do it from there but I typically take it off the flame and send it through filter, let it sit overnight and pour off all but the sugar sand in the bottom. Then heat it up and bottle it. Experiment and see how it works best for you.

doorknob

03-17-2011, 06:55 PM

I finally got my act together today, got the propane burner going in my back yard, and boiled down 3 gallons of sap to make about 8 oz. of what I think is syrup.

I'm using a 5 gallon stainless steel pot to do the boiling, and it sure takes a long time. My lab thermometer was reading 220 degrees well before the liquid became syrup-like, so I don't think that I can use that as my guide. The sudden foaming of tiny bubbles right at the end was my cue to take the pot off of the fire and pour it through the filter, and I think that it worked perfectly.

I have another 7 or 8 gallons of sap that I'll try to process tomorrow.

This stuff is fun, isn't it...

hodorskib

03-17-2011, 07:47 PM

Sounds like you got it close enough, it is tough when you make it in small batches like that. With my thermometer I run about 8 degrees above the boiling point of water for that day and then test with a hydrometer and it is pretty close. Just keep the thermometer from touching the bottom of the pot. I used to boil in a big pot as well until I dig some scrounging and found a 24" x 24" old hotel style lasagna pan. It doubled my surface area and reduced my boiling time. Eventually graduated to a used 2x3 backyard evaporator. Hang in there you caught the fever.

doorknob

03-17-2011, 11:27 PM

1badsapper

03-18-2011, 04:29 AM

We just got started this year as well. We were given an old 24"x 30" pan to get started with. About 25 trees tapped and doing well. Cooking on Fri.

lafite

03-18-2011, 07:58 AM

I suppose that you need a larger batch to use a hydrometer - do you scoop out a few oz. of liquid to put into a separate container in order to use the hydrometer, and then put the liquid back into the batch after making the measurement, or can you dip the hydrometer right into the pan where the sap is boiling?

BTW, I don't mean to hijack this thread, it just seemed to be a good place to exchange info with other Connecticut users...

you will need to get a stainless steel cup for the hydrometer. after you test it, you pour the sap/syrup back into the batch. This will really nail down the quality of your finished product.

newbee

03-22-2011, 09:57 PM

Well I finally boiled all the partial boils I done earlier. WOW!! all I can say. Just awesome. Ended up buying 2 - 10 quarts and another 8- quart ss pots Family dollar had them cheap. Used the hydometer Like you all said, and put it back in thanks lafite. Really had fun with that.

Not to worry doorknob on hijack. The more the merrier in my book. Never to old to learn, and never a know it all.

Hodorskib where did you get the 2 x 3 if you don't mind me asking, and how many gallons (taps) do you do? I'm a sponge, and I caught it all right. Keep hoping Old man winter kicks Mrs Springs butt right out here. I want another 4weeks of 40 degree Days an 28 nights. Screw this spring thing.

I'm not sure who had more fun the kids or me. Ok I do. I'm looking now where to build the sugar house, do I stay near the house, clean up is easier with the water near by and gas too or do I go a 30 yards to the woods and go with a wood fuel (mind if I take some ideas littlesap). Closer to the trees?

Do I ask more neighbors to tap their trees too? Yeah I've got it alright
Can't wait for next year. I might tap in Dec. (Kidding)

Welcome 1badsapper.

A few more questions for anyone...

1. Hydometer has two red lines one at 59 and one at 67 Brix scale. I stopped boiling at 59-60. What happens if I boil longer does it go to 67 and will it get darker?

2. Notices some sugar crystals in the bottom of one of the mason jars I put syurp in not a lot but a few like the crystal kits you buy for the kids to make crystals in. Bad filtering? to cold in fridge? boil to long? not long enough?

3. I don't like caviar, but the later sap I collected the darker it got. Almost black, I'd guess Grade D- but I just like it. The earlier sap was amber and lighter and it's good but put both on vanilla ice cream and the darker was WOW!! Personal prefrence I guess? Does the type of tree dictate the flavor Swap vs sugar vs silver? Or is it just time of season?

4. Had another partial Jar with sugar mounds or mountains in it the next morning when I tilt it on side I see the tall mountains. Filtering? To hot when I put into fridge? boiled to far?

Thanks for all the inputs/advice/ you guys are great with the info. Going to watch the weather hoping to get more sap!!!

hodorskib

03-23-2011, 11:47 AM

I originally purchased an old 55 gallon barrell style evaporator with a 2x3 pan from Woodbury Sugar Shed in Woodbury, CT. Very nice people and extremely helpful in the early years. The barrell has sinced been retired and I had a friend make a better arch for me out of stainless steel that is all firebricked, but I still use the same pan. You can buy one from Leader Evaporator or if you know of anyone that has the ability to work with stainless steel you can have one made for a lot less money. If you go that route you welcome to come up and take measurements off of mine. I have also made a steam hood that sits on top of the pan which allows me to boil in all kinds of weather (rain, snow, wind, etc). I get about 7 gallons per hour evaporation rate with it and about 4 without. I do not have a sugar house or even a shed so I make it right out in the open.

Littlesap

03-23-2011, 12:18 PM

One thing to remember about building the sugar house - you can't move it around once you build it. This sounds rediculous but if you think about it that way, you will force yourself to spend time thinking through all the variables you mention below. I had originally planned some sort of lean-to and getting a hobby evaporator but the good folks at Bascom's said they'd see me next year when I upgraded to a bigger rig :lol:

I like having it a little ways from the house (200') but there is the downside of having to run power out there or use a lantern (like me). Lack of power is why I faced it south, used four windows on each side and glass doors on the front so I could get as much natural sunlight as possible.

It would be nice to have it near your collection point if you use tubing but your landscape needs to cooperate to make that work - and you can always run extra main line and pump it to your evaporator feed tank.

Hope that helps. Before I built mine I went to visit a few different sugar houses. Everyone will have a different opinion and most of us are crazy but more ideas are better than fewer:)

Mike Van

03-24-2011, 04:55 AM

Your question #4 below, that sounds like sugar sand or nitre. You need to filter better to be rid of it.

markct

03-24-2011, 11:37 AM

what do ya mean ya cant move it around! depends how ya make it, mine is on 22 ft long i beam skids, this picture wasnt actualy moving it just lifting it up to do some changes underneath where the skids attached after i put an addition on one side

Starting Small

03-24-2011, 09:05 PM

I tried using a turkey fryer tonight and it went so slow and never really came to a hard boil. I put up some wind breaks around it but that did not seem to work. I ended up just evaporating over an open fire but the ash got in and gave it a smokey flavor. Very tasty just smokey. Any thoughts on how I can avoid the ashes using an open fire or what to do with the turkey fryer to get a hard boil going?

PapaSmiff

03-24-2011, 09:35 PM

I run my turkey fryer in my garage, with the doors closed. I've seen some posts from people who surround the burner with aluminum foil (except for about an inch at the bottom, to let air in) all the way up to the bottom of the pot. Others surrounded it with with bricks or sheet metal.

doorknob

03-24-2011, 10:26 PM

I used a turkey fryer propane burner with my 5 gallon stainless pot, and while evaporation was slow, I was able to (mostly) get a good rolling boil.

One thing to watch out for is the outside temperature - as the ambient temperature drops, the vapor pressure of the propane drops as well, and it's harder to get a good, hot flame going. With this evening's temperature hovering in the mid-30's or below, that will have a noticeable effect, and especially if your tank is running low.

Also, as mentioned above, keeping the wind down is a good idea.

newbee

03-26-2011, 10:59 PM

thanks Hordorskib. Might just take you up on it. Got any Picture?

Littlesap Thanks, I was out checking buckets today got a three gallons yesterday and seraching for new trees for next year and trying to figure out best local. I'm leaning closer to house (power& water etc..) I visited a few houses at the Hebrron Maple feast, and all had power, so have to keep searching. That was a good point on pumping in up to tank too. I'm planning to tap another 50 or so next year, so I trying to plan to reduce leg work and bucket carrying. Maybe going to central dump station and then pump. Have watch $ too.

Mike Van ok I'll try better filtering. Shoudl I reaheat the or just pour off through filter.

Hoping for a better run today and tonight. They were still dripping @ 6 pm. I lightly hammered a few taps that seemed to dry up. Another 20 gallons of sap in the next 2-3 days would be great.

WI Sugarpop

03-27-2011, 04:52 AM

[QUOTE=newbee;145036]

A few more questions for anyone...

1. Hydometer has two red lines one at 59 and one at 67 Brix scale. I stopped boiling at 59-60. What happens if I boil longer does it go to 67 and will it get darker?

2. Notices some sugar crystals in the bottom of one of the mason jars I put syurp in not a lot but a few like the crystal kits you buy for the kids to make crystals in. Bad filtering? to cold in fridge? boil to long? not long enough?

Look at your hydrometer closely. It should say 59 Brix at 211 degrees and 67 Brix at 60 degrees. We take ours to 57 Brix at 211 degrees in the evaporator and then finish it later on gas heat to 59 Brix. If you're getting crystals, you're taking it way to far.

Mike Van

03-27-2011, 05:03 AM

newbee - The syrup won't go through a filter cold, you'd have to re-heat to re-can it anyway. Over 180 is safe to can it. If you make it boil again, it will release more sugar sand I've found. If you draw if out of the jars real carefully, you can leave most of the sand behind, then get to 180 & re-can it. Sedimentation they call it. The rock candy like crystals I've never had, but it sounds like it was boiled too far past syrup.

newbee

03-31-2011, 09:36 PM

Mike Thanks, you saved me a bunch of trouble. I was going to refilter, and didn't know that it would flow. Since I just refrigerated it after I made they syrup, I'm not sure on the canning. If I re-heat to 180, can I just put in glass jars and not have to refrigerate?

WI Sugarpop - Thanks I got it now that makes sense. I was wondering what the 60F meant when it said cold. So if I take it out of Fridge, and let warm to room temp (60F) is should register at the 67 Right?

Keep Holding on old man winter!!! Loving this extra run days

Mike Van

04-01-2011, 01:13 PM

As long as it's over 180 when you seal it, it's supposed to stay good for 2 years I think? Fill the jars as much as you can, don't leave alot of air space.

newbee

04-11-2011, 08:52 AM

Still go a lot to learn, but rookie season is over. Only killed one of the wifes pans and no -wall paper down. Now the planning begins. Tap lines? house? wood or gas burner? tree marking for next year. Can't wait. Thanks for all the helpfull advice. Advice always welcome

Trying to upload picture of bottle with the crystals in (if you can see them). Anybody know what I did wrong? Can I leave as is or do I need to re boil/rebottle?

Uploaded picture of bottle in Community area pictues & Albums