Another roof jack/flue pipe question..... (pics)

[foursapssyrup]

we have finally put the evaporator into our new sugar house. our next step is to have a roof jack made and box off our rafters to install the pipe through the roof. (we should have done this during construction, but we did not know where the final resting place of the evaporator was going to be)

our questions:

how would you run this pipe through the roof? leave it as single wall? (it would require 18" clearance to combustible) double wall it below the roof line? (inside the shack and only 9" clearance) or Double wall it the whole way through the roof? or other? (any other suggestions are great!)

please help, only 4 weeks until we tap the trees!!!

pics for reference!

http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn77/prfakaharry/IMG_6379.jpg

http://i301.photobucket.com/albums/nn77/prfakaharry/IMG_6378.jpg

[bobsklarz]

This looks just like mine. I put it in last year. At this point, I cut the rafter, boxed it in and cut through the roof and put in a piece of double wall insulated stainless. It was pretty expensive for a three foot piece, but I've been up there when the evap was roarin and it was not even hot! Good Luck!:)

[SeanD]

Hey Foursap,

Lookin' good. You've got plenty of time like we all do, right?

I boxed out around the pipe between the rafters that are 24" on center. I made up for the combustible surface distance by stapling ceramic blanket to the rafters. I also only sheathed up to the edge of the rafters so that the pipe only runs through metal roof.

I can't remember from your pics if you've already put the metal roofing on. If so, you could try to cut it out with your circular saw set at a low depth. Of course that would mean you are using it upside-down and over your head. On second thought, maybe you should go with the double-wall.:lol:

I remember when I pulled the permit and I was explaining to the inspector what a sugar house was, he thought he was going to have the fire inspector out to look at it as well. I haven't called for the final inspection, but I might wait until May just in case they have a fit about it. How is your inspector?

Here are pics of how I did it.

Sean

[dnap63]

Sean, I am an inspector over here in NYS, I would pass you no problem but can't speak for the Mass. guys. Typically when dealing with metal chimney's the building code defers to following the manufacturers recomendations.

[SeanD]

Thanks for the vote of confidence. That's good to know. I wouldn't blame them for wanting to play it safe with something that's new to them, but I'd like to avoid having to make modifications this close to the season. I'll still play it "safe" and call him in April or May. Maybe I'll have a half pint of syrup with his name on it when he comes out. :)

Sean

[Sugarmaker]

Double wall if you can get the pipe. then no worrys!
Chris

[foursapssyrup]

thanks for the replies!! i am thinking of putting a piece of double walled on top of the pipe that you see in the pics, to bring it through the roof. i have to talk with the local metal guy and see if he can make a roof jack out of double walled pipe, then neck it back down to a 10" pipe on the outside of the roof.

should i be looking for INSULATED double wall pipe (boy is that stuff expensive!!!), or just make my own double wall with a 10" inside a 12"? anyone know what the clearance to combustibles would be on the homemade one?

we can move the evaporator towards the back wall another 6" or so to clear the rafter that is directly above the pipe, but then we would only have about 2-4" of clearance to it.

[MapleMounder]

Foursapssyrup,

I would be careful trying to make your own double walled pipe. True manufactured double walled pipe has a material between the inner and outer pipe to slow the heat transfer to exterior of the pipe. Thus the exterior of the pipe radiates less allowing you to place the pipe closer to combustibles. If I understand what you are suggesting placing a pipe in a pipe is simply installing a heat shield and will minimally slow the transfer of heat.

You suggested the possibility of moving the evaporator so you would have clearance of 2 – 4” to the rafters or collar ties. If you are going to go with Class A insulated pipe see what the manufacturer of the pipe suggests for the clearance to meet UL rating. Some pipe is 2” clearance, some is 4”, some even zero, just follow your manufactures specs. Unfortunately I have seen a lot of structure fires from improperly installed pipe.

I just put my chimney in last week, I did exactly as you suggest here. Switched from single wall to Class A a few feet below the roof, then continued up through the roof the rest of the way with Class A. The chimney exits through the center of the ridge and extends about 5’ above the roof. I found a company in Scranton, PA called Ventis and got a 8” stainless center ridge roof jack delivered from them for $104.

There are a lot of other great ideas on the Trader, I think it is a preference thing. The main thing is to be safe, Class A pipe is expensive but so is losing your sugarhouse to fire mid-season.

For what it’s worth from an Illinois Fire Chief! Stay Safe, MapleMounder

[waysidemaple]

Maplemounder- what's the phone number or website for that company in scranton? I need a 9 inch roof jack, and I'm relativley close to scranton. Thanks Scott

[MapleMounder]

Waysidemaple,

I ordered what they called the “peak style flashing 304 SS w/storm collar” from a dealer in Michigan called Rockford Chimney Supply. Rockford didn’t have it listed on their site but I emailed them and asked if they had anything for the peak, they said they could get them. Rockford’s website is www.chimneylinerinc.com. The one I ordered from Rockford was manufactured by Olympia Chimney Supply Inc in Scranton. Olympia’s site is www.Olympiachimney.com. They make several different lines and the jack came in a box that said “Ventis” on it. I am not sure if you can by direct from them or not. I ordered mine on a Tuesday morning and had it delivered the next day, like I said it was just over $100 from Rockford with free shipping.

Let me know if I can help with anything else, Rob

[waysidemaple]

Thanks a lot I'll call them in the morning and go from there.

[maple flats]

I made my own triple wall. The single wall goes straight thru the roof, directly thru steel roofing. I had made my truss spacing 30" inside to inside at that one spot, the rest are 24" c-c. My 12" stack thru an actual 30" clear left 9" on each side. I then made a 16" pipe in 28 ga to go from the bottom of the lower truss cord to the underside of the steel roof, and I made a 20" to surround the 16". I then made 2" spacers to pop rivet to the 12" stack and the 16, as well as 2" spacers from the 16 to the 20. Each of these are cut to fit tight against the roof steel and are held up from the bottom by light weight cable and turnbuckles. I had to be inspected by our fire department and they liked what I had done. This was fairly inexpensive, cheaper than your double wall factory made pipe will be. I had the equipment available to make the pipe which made it easy. The 2" space could really have only been 1". By code, every time you put a layer of tin spaced out 1" on non combustable spacers you cut the clearance requirement in half. A single wall pipe requires 36", 1 layer makes 18", second layer makes 9", and if needed a third layer makes 4.5" needed.

[foursapssyrup]

just wanted to update a little. we got about 5' of double wall insulated (class A) stove pipe, and now have to get a roof jack made and we are in business!!!

one more question: we are going up through the roof with the insulated pipe, then want to switch back to the single wall pipe, (cause it's what we have already) is there an adapter to go from 10" double wall to 10" single wall? i have been doing some searching and coming up empty. are there any drawbacks to going back to the single wall?

[maple flats]

There should be no drawbacks. Try it to see, The inner pipe on your double wall might be the same as the single wall pipe. If not, go to a supply house that plumbing and heating contractors go (rather than Lowes, Home Depot or a hardware store), you should be able to get any adapter there.

[Brokermike]

You will likely need a 12" to 10" adapter. The 10" double wall should have an OD of 12"

[adk1]

I will eventually be doing the same thing here. I hope to have a WF Mason 2x4 in my possession this year, but not in time for this season of course. Anyways, I will need to make some modifications to my current garage, which is to be my sugarhouse. It is the perfect setup. Anyways, I am not so worried about stemming through the chimney pipe as I am trying to decide if I am going wit hthe conventional coupala style sugarhouse (which I really like) or am I going to add some kind of hood and stem another pipe up through my roof. I jsut dont know right now. Any thoughts or suggestions on how everyone else did it I would appreciate the stories.